Amazon.com Widgets

« Henry Waxman - Healthcare | Main | Links With Your Coffee - Sunday »

Links With Your Coffee - Friday

coffee.gif


 

Comments

For me, the appeal of organic has always been in lowering my chances of ingesting potentially harmful pesticides, and the potentially lower environmental impact. It never even occurred to me that organics might be more nutritious.

I'm also not a nut about organics though, I opt for local over organic and am not willing to pay a huge price premium for it.

Hey Norm, I'm not a computer buff but I think the "Is that you JB." link gooe to "Robots from Mars" It doesn't work the other way.

hi, i'm jb and i'm also mystified by the link provided. maybe the acid references, or the fact the guy looks kind of like me?..

some bizarre links here. re: the dawkins rap- do i understand correctly that this was made as anti-dawkins agitprop, and later adopted by evolutionists as being cool somehow?

and what about the breakfast club director? what's the connection with 1gm?

also, i can't help but see the humor in the way you're pushing the crow story, as it seems to "prove the authenticity of an ancient, hitherto-assumed-to-be fable", norm. :)

hi, i'm jb and i'm also mystified by the link provided. maybe the acid references, or the fact the guy looks kind of like me?

I've fixed the link, it will make more sense to you now.

also, i can't help but see the humor in the way you're pushing the crow story, as it seems to "prove the authenticity of an ancient, hitherto-assumed-to-be fable", norm. :)

It is has nothing to do with the fable. I just think crows are amazing. When I was a young lad my grandmother told me amazing stories about the exploits of magpies. Some of them may even have been true.

It is has nothing to do with the fable

well, think a moment about the fable anyway, waddya say? combined with it's modern scientific outcome, it's pregnant with "anecdotal" story possibilities.

I sent the original link to Norm because, like him, I think corvids are great. We have a bunch of jackdaws who come to our garden regularly to use the feeders we have for garden birds, and whatever I do to thwart their feeding, they get round it. It has become a game for them and me - something like an arms race.

I've fixed the link, it will make more sense to you now.

hey, that ain't my cave. that guy's a slob. i had a wife and a 1 year old daughter. i had fucking running water and a wood stove. the place was spankin'. please.

Yeah, I couldn't figure how you would get internet in there.

had never touched a mouse at that point. not the plastic kind, anyway. got bit by a bat..

I was pretty sure it wasn't you, no guitar in sight, but I thought of you when I saw the picture.

RE: The organic vs. conventional debate

There are some good points in this link, including comments. The most important one is that we consume too much meat in comparison to the amount of fruit and vegetable we eat.

In terms of the nutrition value of "organic" vs. "conventional" food, this is quite the can of worms. First, from the diet benefits or deficits:

  1. I have no doubt that the food contain the same nutrients

  2. Factors to consider for food:

a. pesticide content b. how long has it been since the food was harvested and the consumer purchased and ate the food? (frozen foods won't pose the same issue as those left fresh) leading to c. was the food actually ripe when it was picked? Did it ripen naturally or was there some ethelyne gas used in the process? d. Taste!

  1. Factors to consider for the soil:

a. Pesticides b. Crop cities/uniform crop growth - this depletes soil value unless there is rotation or other diversity c. using fuel to produce fuel ruins the soil (adding nitrogen takes fuel, and the result is often a product that goes to make fuel (ex: corn) rather than food.

  1. Why I placed quotation marks around "organic" and "conventional":

a. Legalizing the term organic resulted in dilution of the original effort, because some farmers wanted the label, but worried about revenue in putting non-pesticde farming, multi-crop farming (as well as non-hormonal cattle farming) into practice. Buying food at a store - even a Fresh Fields or local Organic Grocer - often means purchasing food that came from miles away with a label that may depict reality or a dreamy fiction.

You want to have a better handle on your food? Buy at farmers markets whenever you can. Talk to the farmers about how they run the farm, and decide if you want to be eating that product or not.

My favorite growers invite their clients to the farm, sometimes to help (the helpers are rewarded with a big meal and maybe even a bag from the harvest). you don't necessarily have to visit, but asking some friendly questions can help you make your decisions. You may pay more, less, or the same as the grocery store depending on your living area. at least the money goes directly to the farmer.

b. As for conventional food, that is a very broad, and often includes industrialized food - a term the should not exist. Maybe conventional food comes from a garden that uses pesticides only when infestation is imminent, or comes from a copyrighted genetically modified seed crop, and/or comes from crops that are routinely dusted with chemicals. If you don't mind, go ahead and eat this. It's got to be better than a straight diet of fast food. The chemical presence may appear to be gone after washing the fruit, but how gone? All gone? Slightly gone? Your risk.

I've heard that the mass crop production has fed the world, but this argument is weak for a number of reasons. The most obvious is that many are still starving, or are mal-nourished. If you consider lack nutrient depletion from day picked to day eaten, chemical ingestion that results in health problems, and soil destruction, you have to ask yourself the true worth or food produced on a mass scale.

I apologize for such a long post. I feel that this issue affects our planet's population way more than we care to admit. We brush nutritional concerns off fairly easily - too easily IMO. Now I'm off to see what the weird link is all about.

having worked on (many) commercial farms, and also been a part of the "back to the land movement" or whatever it's called, it seems to me a nobrainer that organic is better- IF you can afford it. as for the nutrition issue, i never thought they'd be able to prove organic was better in this area, and they haven't. so...? as far as taste, you don't need a scientific study, fercrisakes. i'll testify here and now from much experience. and less pesticides in the chain? just makes common sense.

fercrisakes.

;~) You going new testament on us?

The "organic" food movement is, at its core, about people wanting to have control over what food they put in their bodies, which is something I can't argue with.

On a related note, I find it ironic (or just more evidence of doublethink) that I've heard a lot of complaining about "organic" food from conservatives/republicans, but the increase in sales of "organic" food is a good example of the Free Market working (albeit very slowly). The customer should get what he/she wants, and not have standard-issue rations shoved down their throats.

I recently discovered Organic Milk.. OMF. Normal milk tastes like chemicals and blah, and Organic Milk tastes like the milk I grew up way back when. Yummy when ice cold.

There is the argument against the Organic movement that may hold water... That land (short term) produces more food, and the world is hungry. Going Organic is 'selfishly' using land for 'gourmet' food instead of considering the needs of others.

But being a Kansas Boy, I believe our current course will exhaust the land of nutrients and hurt our future ability to produce food.

There is the argument against the Organic movement that may hold water... That land (short term) produces more food, and the world is hungry. Going Organic is 'selfishly' using land for 'gourmet' food instead of considering the needs of others.

This is more of an argument against companies like ConAgra and the way they carry out the process of farming. The soil is terribly taxed and must be manipulated via chemical means to keep it producing.

I will say that organic farming that focuses on mono crop production is only a step in the right direction in that it eschews the use of chemicals. Some diversity must be carried out on the farm, with either mixed planting or crop rotation to sustain the eco-system for food production. Sustainable farms will keep us going - then gain, only if there are enough of them.

The "organic" food movement is, at its core, about people wanting to have control over what food they put in their bodies, which is something I can't argue with.

I tend to agree with folks that the dismissal of organic food because of the lack of evidence of superior nutritional content.

In my mind it has three main advantages

  1. Better Taste

  2. less chemicals on the food and in the water, chemicals that affect our health in countless ways

  3. less damaging to the environment in both use of chemicals but in a number of other ways as well.

I remember reading somewhere there were more antioxidants in organic fruit and I was pleasantly surprised (now I'm not sure if that's true or not) but, like others here, I don't eat it for that - I think it's healthier for the planet and for me. If it's about avoiding pesticides, there are lists that tell you what is more important to eat organic, if it's about the politics of food, I try and shop at the farmer's market, too (unbelievable how much better the fruit tastes), and other things like wild salmon v. farmed (a dinner party sitting next to a fisherman was the impetus there), shade grown coffee (for friends - I'm a tea drinker), etc. It is more costly and sometimes it's not feasible.

BTW - it's not easy to do. I had a friend turn his citrus farm organic and it was very hard ("a huge pain in the @ss that takes 10 years" is the quote)

Navigation

Support this site

Google Ads


Powered by Movable Type Pro

Copyright © 2002-2017 Norman Jenson

Contact


Commenting Policy

note: non-authenticated comments are moderated, you can avoid the delay by registering.

Random Quotation

Individual Archives

Monthly Archives