So only 40% of Americans accept evolution. And some percentage of that 40% are rednecks. It's not easy being a liberal atheist in the good old U.S.of A where the majority response to any criticism is, "America, love it or leave it". :(

Stewart once called, in its early days, the War in Iraq "WARGASM"--when we where taking Baghdad. If Hersh's sources in the Whitehouse are accurate, then I'd say we're prematurely ejactulated on this one.

I actually turn to page 57.

And it works.

"You can pass any law you want but it won't change the shape of the Earth," Miller told LiveScience.

I am putting that on a bumper-sticker, I am.

On how to read a novel.

May I humbly recommend reading my work. It's really raw, poorly edited and has fallen through the hands of gazillions of publishers. Seriously. Starting at the bottom can be humbling. There's too much well written stuff out there. Right? It's time to start promoting us bad writers.

-tgs-

How easy it for you to believe the "dubious veracity" of Israel statements, even though you have nothing but “hunch” to verify it. And on the other hand you said nothing about the fake images and the Hizbolla “art of death and misery” scenes coming from Lebanon. At list 2 journalists (one American and the other British) reported on the Hizbolla directed death scenes and about their representatives threats on foreign journalists to “fix” their reports. But you just comment on what you choose based on your own prejudices. well, I guess it's “cooler” to take the side of the underdog. But you know what? You cant lie to everybody all the time. and only time will prove those "dubious" statements right. i just hope it wont be a little too late.

Those damn Israelis... always spinning....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BT5gDjg1coc

Nice argument. They do it too.

Tu Quoque is a very common fallacy in which one attempts to defend oneself or another from criticism by turning the critique back against the accuser. This is a classic Red Herring since whether the accuser is guilty of the same, or a similar, wrong is irrelevant to the truth of the original charge. However, as a diversionary tactic, Tu Quoque can be very effective, since the accuser is put on the defensive, and frequently feels compelled to defend against the accusation.

Source:

S. Morris Engel, With Good Reason: An Introduction to Informal Fallacies (Fifth Edition) (St. Martin's, 1994), pp. 204-206.

Anderson Cooper wasn't reporting that Hezbollah does it 'too.' He was reporting that they do it, period.

I think Hezbollah manufacturing news is relevant. It calls into question the veracity of its claims and certainly suggests they are not the victims they purport to be. If you want to believe their lies, that's up to you. The point is they lie, distort and put their civilians in danger so that people like you will throw shit fits about murderous Israelis. If Hezbollah wants to use their civilians as pawns and shields, they're the criminals, not Israel.

You're always so quick to bring in your 'two wrongs don't make a right' philosophy when it suits you. Tell Hezbollah to stop launching its missiles in response to Israel's bombings. Go ahead.

For someone who is so quick to judge and mock religion because it doesn't stand up to the facts, you're quick to discount or ignore the facts when they don't support your own beliefs.

two wrongs is not a philosophy, it is a logical fallacy, and one that you commit over and over again in your defense of Israel. Will you kindly point out where I said some action of Hezbollah's was legitimate because Israel did it too. I'm not ignoring nor defending Hezbollah's spinning of the news. I don't excuse it. You on the other hand seem to hold the view that if Hezbollah are murdering thugs that gives Israel carte blanche to do anything they want. Let me repeat, I'm not making the argument that because Israel does it it is okay for Hezbollah to do likewise. I think if you read what I've written my claim is that innocent civilians have been harmed through Israel's reckless behavior, I have not defended Hezbollah actions that have shown similar disregard for civilian life. The most that can be garnered from the they do it too argument is one of hypocrisy. Here's a challenge for you Zak, point out where I've used the same tactic. Show me where I argued that it was okay for Hezbollah to kill civilians because Israel was killing civilians. You are the only one presenting the flawed argument. It is obvious that you don't care if your arguments are logically sound or not, but don't expect to present them here and not get called on it.

Let me add you are right Cooper Anderson wasn't reporting Israel does it too, and I agree he was presenting the facts. The problem is that you are using those facts to excuse AIPAC from doing likewise.

Ever since the beginning of this war Israel's respond to launching rockets on its civilians was door to door fighting, clearing village after village, facing those Iranian warriors (with their unmistakable Persian tattoos) risking its soldiers in order not to harm civilians. airplane raids where only on verified targets after warning those "innocent" civilians (how do you call a bunch of kids playing football next to Fajer rocket launcher ready to "roll"? - no, you want call it exploitation of children for military purposes... you wont call it cynicism...). Every time a “noble” soul rises up, tries to teach the IDF what morality is, i can only sit back and surrender to the virtual retrospective running in my mind of all those western moral nations and all those western moral armies in the last 100 years of history of violence. I am proud of our high moral standards, and i say “ours” because those soldiers are actually each and every one of us. Those are our morals. By the way, about those "kids" playing football, It was decided to live them alone. 2 minuets later this rocket arrived Haifa and killed 3 civilians. 2 minuets after that, this launcher was destroyed.

I am not excusing AIPAC from doing anything. I'm saying that by criticizing AIPAC for manufacturing news but ignoring that the other side is at least as bad, you imply that AIPAC is doing something the other side isn't. You're like a republican politician ranting about his democratic opponent's lack of family values, while you cheat on your wife. The democrat's defense shouldn't be "well, he does it too" (you're correct there) but it sure as hell can be "he's a hypocrite." If the republican wants to make a case for family values, why isn't the fact he's a lying cheat and a hypocrite relevant? I think it is.

As for your previous post, I'm not about to sift through all your previous posts to make my point. You just bring up this 'logical fallacy' argument as if that's the way the world works. While you confer with Plato, Israeli soldiers get kidnapped and civilians get bombed because some Islamic nutjobs think killing lots of Jews will get them into heaven. There's not a lot of logic in that.

Alright Kevin, then say that I'm being hypocritical if I try to justify Hezbollah's action by pointing out that Israel is doing it too. The post was about AIPAC spinning. You failed to acknowledge that it was true AIPAC was spinning. Then pointed out that Hezbollah also spins, the implication was clear. If you intend to make the charge that it is hypocritical of Hezbollah to make the charge then make it. You would be correct in that charge. But that is not an argument I've ever made, so I take offense to the accusation. The problem is linking the two, criticizing the one and not the other thereby implying that it is okay because the other guy does it. If I had posted a story criticizing Hezbollah for doctoring photographs, and you had said well look at Israel they do similar things, without acknowledging that both were wrong. I would have called you on that as well.

http://zakdegrassi.blogs.com/zakdegrassi/2006/07/when_antiisrael.html

Interesting posting but you're still putting words in people's mouths. You still see things as black and white even though time and again Norm has stated he's not condoning what either side is doing.

Your site is filled with anger so I now understand why you make the statements you do. IMO you're part of the problem. Both sides have built up so much hate toward each other and until both sides start being competely honest there won't be a solution.

I'm sick of the dishonesty and the propaganda to make the other side look like the bad guy in order to justify killing. Both sides are guilty and it's counter productive if they want it to stop.

I don't think my money should be used to fund your war though.