Fair Game?
For Israel, innocent civilians are fair game
But after days of contradictory statements about Qana, the Israeli military was reported as saying it had no indication of rocket fire or Hezbollah presence in Qana on the day of the strike, and had bombed the area in retaliation for rockets launched days earlier. . .My notebook overflows with reports of civilian deaths. On July 15, Israeli fire killed 21 people fleeing from Marhawin, including 13 children; no weapons, no Hezbollah nearby. On July 16, an Israeli bomb killed 11 civilians in Aitaroun, including seven members of a Canadian-Lebanese family on vacation; again, no Hezbollah, no weapons. On July 19, at least 26 civilians were killed in Srifa when Israeli bombs flattened an entire neighborhood; no evidence of military targets. On July 23, at least seven civilians were killed when Israeli warplanes bombed dozens of cars trying to flee the south after receiving Israeli instructions to evacuate immediately; no indication of weapons convoys in the vicinity. The list goes on, with about 500 civilians killed so far. . .
Not only has Israel failed to distinguish between military and civilian targets; its own officials suggest that they have decided any civilian still in the south is fair game. Last week, Justice Minister Haim Ramon reportedly said, "All those now in south Lebanon are terrorists who are related in some way to Hezbollah."
So if you are too frightened to flee southern Lebanon, or are sick, injured or too poor to pay the more than $1,000 it now costs to get out, you are a "terrorist" and eligible for attack. As for those who heeded the Israeli warnings to flee, the roads are littered with bombed civilian cars, many with white flags still attached to their windows. After all, the Israelis tell us, they could have been transporting arms. Israel is prefabricating excuses to justify killing civilians.
Comments
Didn't you know? It is only prudent to kill Lebanese babies. That way they cannot grow up to be terrorists.
And the poor and the elderly? Well come on -- they are arabs, after all, not people.
And best of all, since events don't have causes, this is 100% guaranteed not to lead to future terrorism.
Yay "democracy"! Go "democracy"! Body count is in the house!
I am astonished by the abject silence of the whole world, especially the so called "Muslim" world. Instead of doing something IMMEDIATELY, the fsck-wits are scheduling fsking meeting on TALKING about what to do!
In the words of Louis Armstong, "What wonderful world"
Go! Go! Go! Hooray! http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fisk/article1211295.ece
P.S. How fast would you think that the world would react if the civilians being killed were Jewish and attackers were Muslim?
Not fast at all, Farhan. Actually Jewish civilians are being killed every day by Hezbollah rockets targeting Israeli cities, and I dont heard outrage from you guys.
Apparently it's only a war crime when Arabs get killed. When Hezbollah kidnaps Israeli soldiers or targets Israeli cities with the Iranian missiles, that doesnt count.
Funny, that.
For a clipping that makes some powerful suggestions it sure uses the word reportedly pretty liberally. In terms of a war without any red lines should the Israelis not be allowed to indiscriminately attack civilians, as Hizbollah does? Does Hizbollah release apologies/regrets or initiate investigations when one of its rockets hit and kill Israeli civilians? Yes we hold Israel to a higher standard, but the important thing is that they actually meet that standard; when mistakes happen as appears to be the case here, they ANNOUNCE it and attempt to amend it.
Of course you're right -- Hezbollah fires rockets into Israel, and Hezbollah is in Lebanon, so who could ever dispute Israel's absolute and god-given right to kill as many innocent Lebanese civilians as they want?
Makes perfect sense to me!
Hey, I heard there might be a few in Paris -- better start killing French civilians too!
I agree with Zak and orhan, no matter what you report here, Israel is not trying to target civilians, and its just stupid to think that. Israel is trying hard not to harm any civilians but Hizbollah are making it very hard.
Hizbollah's only goal is to kill civilians, allmost 2000 missiles were fired on Israeli cities since this mess started, never heard them apologies about Israeli civilians Deaths.
I hate to sound so hawkish on this subject but it really messes with my sense of fairness.
I want a list of every significant hit from a Hezbolah rocket if you are going to start laying out attack reports.
Urban Guerrillas survive by getting civilians killed. That's the only reason the tactic works. Guerrilla warfare is practically a warcrime all by itself. Yes, in times of desperation it is appropriate but it has gone way beyond that now.
Guerrilla warfare is the new standard tactic of every weak organization with a grudge nowdays. Being the underdog is now somekind of special pass to make political demands by cheating. We don't hold them to account though. For some reason it is always the people attempting to defend themselves by the rules under the microscope.
Congradulations for enabling the cheaters by buying into their strategy. Everybody agrees that killing innocent civilians is horrible. What burns my ass is that nobody seems to point out that the ones who have AN INTEREST in civilian deaths is Hezbolah.
It is the guerrillas who must be held to a higher standard, not a nation with a clearly marked military desperately trying to make out the difference between who is and who is not a threat.
To hear some people talk, guerrillas can basically demand a nations destruction and cheat any way they want toward that goal and any nation with an organized military should just shut up and put up with their threats and attacks because there is no defense to their aggression without hurting innocent people.
Bullshit. Hezbolah uses civilians as both camoflage and targets. Don't get all high and mighty about how Isreal must be watched to make sure they fight fair.
Every Arab in the street shouting "Death To Isreal!" should feel proud because those Lebanese civilians have become martyrs so that they can keep shouting.
Yeah, war is hell and all that, but somehow I expect more from Israel.
Actually Farhan, the world would respond with contempt if Israeli casualties match Lebanese kills by Israel's carpet bombing.
But since Israel has killed far more innocent Arab civilians while driving millions to refugee camps, it's not that hard to imagine why the world has legitimate grounds to condemn Israel.
Stop trying to use what-if scenarios to excuse the reality of the 60-year old Holocaust that Jews in Israel has unleashed in the Middle East.
You will get ZERO sympathy.
Last count is 800 Lebanese killed by Israeli air strikes compared to 26 Israeli civilians killed by Hezbollah's answering rocket fire.
Zak and Farhan seem to be avoiding the fact that Hezbollah targeted Israeli civilians in this recent conflict ONLY AFTER ISRAEL BOMBED all civilian areas in all of Lebanon.
They are obviously insane by expecting the Lebanese not to fight back against Israeli carpet bombing of Lebanon, in which Hezbollah's rockets are its only resistance.
Only an idiot will expect any country, even those as militarily week like Lebanon to just play dead when a former invader of Lebanon like Israel bombs Lebanon to kingdom come.
Israel is clearly targeting civilian areas and the unabated answering rocket fire from Hezbollah clearly points to the fact that Hezbollah are not storing any of their rockets in these areas.
The view that Israeli is deliberately targeting civilians is becoming increasingly justified.
"Israel has been heavily criticized for the killings across Lebanon. In a report released Wednesday (this week), Human Rights Watch said it had documented 153 deaths of Lebanese civilians. It said the killings formed a pattern so extensive that it seemed to indicate that the Israelis were deliberately targeting civilians. It went so far as to accuse Israel of war crimes."
Killing in Lebanon reflects firepower imbalance By Sabrina Tavernise The New York Times August 3, 2006
http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/02/news/civil.php
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Why do those people who claimed they support Israel but condemn civilian deaths by both sides spend all their time condemning the use of primitive or even homemade weapons by Arabs fighting instead of condemning Israel’s indiscriminate use of modern military force, which kill far more civilians?
Especially when Arab rocket fire is IN RESPONSE to Israel’s military aggression when it attacked Gaza Strip and Lebanon after provoking Arab response? You tell me.
Dead of Civilians is 100% fault of those MISERABLE HEZBOLLAH! They use human shields, not Israel !!!
As long as the arab mindset remains that the taking of Jewish life is more important than the saving of Arab life, we'll stay stuck at this point.
Here is the root problem the international community faces when giving advice. If the muslim civilians anywhere from Morocco to Pakistan go out to the street and celebrate the death of Israeli civilians after a suicide bombing or a soldier's kidnapping, or Katyusha rocket launch the world accepts it as part of islamic culture. If Israel apologizes for accidental bombing either UN or civilian they are accused of war crimes and lying. Imagine if the Israelis were dancing in the street after the Qana tragedy. If the international community really wants to weigh in, there needs to be equal expectations.
Hezbollah as a routine behave uses civilians as human shield, Hezbollah as a routine targets civilians, children, women in Israel!!!
Did you ever opened your mouths against the daily DELIBERATELY launched 100 missiles and MORE each day ONLY on Israeli cities and villages?!
i havent seen any mainstream american voice support hezbollah, but plenty support israel. hezbollah does not need to be denounced, everyone already knows they are awful. i dont see any debate about whether hezbollah is justified, i think we are in agreement. however, there is much debate about whether israel is justified.
is it not obvious why israel's crimes are focused on?
the plain fact is that israel has caused far more damage than hezbollah.
One incredibly simple truth people seem to fail to understand is that the "a thousand arab eyes for a jewish eye" (and vice versa, of course) mentality in play here will perpetuate all this violence endlessly.
By shattering the lives of thousands of hapless Lebanese, Israel is effectively creating the next generation of Hezbollah. They are making it easier for agitators to spoon-feed their vile rhetoric to the people because Israel is CREATING a demographic that has further grievance against it, and no way to handle it, in their minds, but by avenging the senseless slaughter perpetrated against them by replying in kind.
This, I think, is why some people say that in many ways Israel has itself to blame for much of the violence. Although it is true that nothing justifies terrorism, you cannot hide behind this fact to dispel the consequences of a nation's actions. If Israel continues on this seemingly ironfisted campaign, showing little remorse for civilian casualties, then the consequences will be tens of thousands angry at Israel and looking for a place to direct that anger. Sociologically the ramifications could be even more dire; Arabs could come to hold Israel to be just as monstrous as those that terrorize it, and become even more loath to stand up against the terrorist organizations.
How does and organized fighting force make a distinction between good civilians and bad civilians?
Is there such a thing as a grass roots army that the grass roots shares no responsibility for?
Countries raise designated armies so that civilians are less likely to get killed.
True, but that isn't justification for the reckless disregard of those civilian population. It seems to me that Israel is operating on something like if there is a 10 percent chance we'll kill a Hezbollah fighter then it is okay to kill all the civilians we know are in the same area.
Hi, those Pro-Israel supporters here are clear cut liars.
Why would the Hezbollahs use civilians as shields when Israel bomb civilians anyway?
When did Israel ever provide real proof that Arab resistance fighters uses civilian shields?
Why would the Hezbollah want to alienate their civilain base?
Why are Hezbollah's rocket fire continuing at higher levels than before when Israel is bombing civilian homes where they claimed Hezbollah had hid their rockets?
Could it be because the rockets were not kept there in the first place.
The fact remains that Hezbollah killed more Israeli soldiers who are attacking Lebanon than Israeli civilians.
This clearly give Hezbollah a higher moral position when it comes to defending Lebanon against an illegitimate carpet bombing that Israel is inflicting on all of Lebanon.
Btw, the Israeli themselves used kidnapping as a tactic to spark off their invasion and bombing of the Gaza Strip a few weeks before their Lebanese invasion and destruction:
Israel captures pair in Gaza raid 24 Jun 2006 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5112846.stm
Israeli soldiers have seized two Palestinian men in an overnight raid into the southern Gaza Strip. The Israeli military said the two brothers were members of the militant group Hamas and were planning attacks on Israel. Hamas said they were sons of a member but were not involved in Hamas. It called the abduction a crime. Israel pulled out of Gaza last summer but there remains a regular exchange of missile fire....
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