oy.

that gotta hurt...

Why do people allow this fat idiot to speak for them? Why is he constantly held up as a shining example of progressive/leftist thought, when all he does is parrot the things other true thinkers and investigators have been saying for ages - adding his weak, pathetic attempts at comedy?

Michael Moore is an also-ran who gets all the attention simply because he is rich enough to throw his substantial weight behind any of his vanity projects. Please, for the love of god will 'liberal' America wake up and recognize this opportunist, war profiteer, and general vulture of human misery for what he is?

Tiger should shut the fuck up.

What a dumb ass -- he's obviously stung by the reality of voting in the current administration, and can't stand the notion that he is in some way responsible for the travisty happening in Iraq, Afganistan and the Mississippi delta.

Poor dumb bastige. Support the pending recall and otherwise prostrate yourself.

Joe, I'm getting tired of reading your content-emtpy comments. There are only so many ways you can tell us that you think we are mistaken in our criticism of Bush. Add something new to the conversation, perhaps make some arguments and support them with evidence, or you could just shut the fuck up.

Why isn't incompetence a prerequisite for impeachment?

Why is that when somebody points the potential fallacies of an argument every one else immediatly attack him/her. Joe has a right to make his point, instead of makeing him look ridiculas you should make his argument look ridiculas. The whole point of these posts are to have a reasonable discussion, every time you guys react in such a way it destroys the oppurtonity for a true exchange of ideas.

I agree that Michael Moore manipulates and distorts the truth to present his prespective of reality. Yet before you call him "war profiteer, and general vulture of human misery" you should look into the current administrations cabinate for better examples of vultures and war profiteers.

michael moore is a dumb ass? he distorts the truth? he is only interested in profiting off of others misery? wow ... he and george bush should get along good together-- hey, i listen to rush limbaugh too, but it's just for entertainment-- seriously

peace

I agree that Michael Moore manipulates and distorts the truth to present his prespective of reality. Yet before you call him "war profiteer, and general vulture of human misery" you should look into the current administrations cabinate for better examples of vultures and war profiteers.

bump!

Stick to the points he's making people!

Nowhere in his letter is MM claiming to be the Liberal's Messiah speaking for all progressives of the world, he's saying what he feels needs to be said as he has always done, and in a country with a supposed reverence for free speech, all the so-called uber patriots should respect that without resorting to personal attacks. You don't agree? argue the points!

After all, the letter is a very valid open question to those who voted for W in '04, so honestly, how does it feel?

P.S. Remember the term used by westerners to refer to developing countries as Banana Republics? There's a new one to define over stretched empires, it's The Horse Show Federation.

Here's a better idea, if I may: This letter addresses questions, over whether voters who chose Bush feel their choice was right. Changing the arguement to "why do we listen to Michael Moore" is another subject, and dodges the issue. If we all want to find some answers together, we should start by not devolving into arguing side-points.

So, those who read this blog and voted for Bush, please tell us how you feel. If you do feel Bush is doing a good job, by all means tell us why. Here is your stage. Make points, and we will listen and respond.

While I am not a fan of Michael "Distort The Facts For My Own Purposes" Moore and obesity has nothing to do with his propensity to distort - nor does his thin veiled affiliation with the Democratic Party (remember the last National Democratic Convention), I do agree with points made here, in regards to speaking to one another as American (or as Shrub would say 'Mericans) and that accountability in government is absolutely necessary.

I think the magic word here is cronyism - get your out of work buddies a job where you are until you are fired and have to do it all over again. It is also about appointing and/or hiring "in DUH viduals" in lesser positions that will insure that you keep your job at the top and in the President's case - that will prevent him from being impeached. Consider that King George Bush (KGBI)the First did this by "hiring" a guy for vice-pres that can't even spell potato... Eveyone thought that KGBI (not to be confused with his counterpart in the former Soviet republic) was stupid and dumb to select James Danforth Quayle as his running mate - when you have to also remember that KGBI was also the head of the CIA and you aren't dumb to be in that position - KGBI was just making himself un-impeachable.

Even so, KGBII (we all know who this is), has, IMHO, used the trickle down theory quite well. Who is going to rely upon Dick Cheney to run the country, or Condie Rice or the post master general (Maybe when it was Ben Franklin, it was a good idea)? So King George Bush II has learned from Papa Schrub how to do it all - with one caveat - King George the Second not only does not qualify to be the President of the United States by intellect or any other way but he cannot spell CIA - much less work there.

How do you hold George Bush and his cronies accountable? Get off of your lazy asses and VOTE!!! In 2006, get rid of the Republican majority in The House of Representatives and when 2008 hits get rid of the Republican majority in the Senate and for God's sake (however you relate to God) get rid of the GOP (stands for Good OleBoys Party) in the White House and state houses and governerships.

I am from Hawaii in the States and I can proudly say we didn't elect the Son of a Beoch.

Complaining and postulating (no matter your celebrity) does no good at all - following the electorial process does. You really have no right to complain if you didn't vote and if you did vote, then you can truly relate to this thought:

You are what makes America different than any other nation. How? Your vote counts. You can effect change and you can legally encourage your neighbors and fellow constituents to vote without the fear of reprisal. If the proceedings do not go as you had hoped or planned, you can vote again and get more of your neighbors to vote again.

Let this be the new war cry against cronyism: "Remember New Orleans and Vote the Bastards Out!"

Don't just demand change - be the change.

Moore brings up the issue of saftey, a valid question for deconstructing some peoples' rationale. Then there's morality. How about it Christians? Then there are your traditional conservatives, to whom I would ask, Why vote for a president who has only increased the size of government, and inefficiently at that?

I didn't vote for Bush. I'm sure there are other cases than I'm about to mention, but I think these are a couple reasons why people voted for him:

Most people either don't have time, or don't care to make time for understanding politics. The politicians have only benefitted from this. Elections, for the above mentioned categories of people are image vs image, not fact versus fact. And if you, as a conservative, don't fall into these categories, you probably justify your Bush vote by spitting several platitudes and talking points, which only proves that you pay attention to politics by watching the TV news and probably lack important critical faculties. That or you mistakingly call yourself, as our president does, a conservative.

This sounds harsh, but comes from someone whose conservative dad just decided he hates Bush because there were no WMDs and didn't vote Kerry because a Swift Boat book told him that Kerry is a war criminal. We knew about the WMDs and the reliability of the Swift Boat Vets long before the election in 2004.

Bush's only talent is locking gullible people inside his ever-expanding bubble of relativism. The media often helps with this.

Thank goodness for the conservatives I've met who think Bush is a moron. Damn the ones who vote based on party lines. Your party has changed in the past 25 years! Both parties need to be revamped from the bottom up. Wishful thinking.

I love how people always bash Michael Moore.

If you don't agree with him, so be it, but at least he goes out there and says what he feels needs to be said.

Marina is right, nowhere does he claim to be anything he's not.

Whether you agree or disagree with him, or whether you think he "distorts the truth", the keyword there is truth. He's telling the truth.

People always call him a liar, but no one can seem to point out where he's lied about something. 99% of what he says and puts into his movies have some sort of source, whether it be from an article in the New York Times or in a book by another author; if his sources are wrong, that's not his fault, at least he has a source unlike people like Ann Coulter who just spew bullshit and have nothing to back it up (except for things that have nothing to do with what she's talking about..see: Al Franken's chapter on her in his book "Lies...").

Blah.

I thought the letter was good. How do these people feel?

regardless of whether or not his points are valid, this letter is just too obnoxious. stick to attacking bush, not the voters.

et:

Wrong. The voters put Bush there in the first place. They need to know they own part of this pie.

"My Republican friends, does it bother you that we are the laughing stock of the world?"

Comments like this make me think Moore does more harm than good.

I Disagree with Moores statement that you are the laughing stock of the world.

I think more people are just bloody scared that your administration is also in charge of a huge nuclear stockpile. Not really a laughing matter

Do you believe in Jesus? Really? Didn't he say that we would be judged by how we treat the least among us?

No. He didn't. Many others said such things, not the least of which included Samuel Johnson, Mahatma Ghandi, and Winston Churchill. Not Jesus: Matthew 25:40 (which no doubt Michael Moore was mistakenly refering to) discusses how you as an individual should treat others, not society. Indeed, Jesus was rather, erm, careful not to criticize government and society, for better or for worse. Hence, for example, his couched phrase "Render under Caesar that which is Caesar's, and under God that which is God's".

This letter was a most repugnant rant to deliver to America on September 11th, when we are all united in remembering the Attack Upon America. Mr. Moore does not have comments enabled, so I will answer the questions he asked me here:

Dear Mr. Moore - It feels really, really great to know that for four years this country has not been attacked by our enemies, present company excluded.

Furthermore, Mr. Moore, your constant attacks aren’t worth a tinker’s damn. You bring shame upon yourself and your followers by the venom-filled epistle you wrote to your own country on its national day of mourning. The more you unfairly attack George Bush, the more the rest of us love him and the more we pray for him. Few presidents have had such heavy burdens placed upon their shoulders and this president has earned the respect of his people. You, Mr. Moore have earned their contempt with your juvenile impudence and surley unmannerlyness. You have made yourself into the national laughingstock.

PS: For your information, George Bush owns no second home in Washington, D.C. The house he lives in, the White House, belongs to the American people. You need to take Civics Class 101.

norm, i think the worst is yet to come. with 3 more years, we are all alone now.

Wow, what a bunch of ... completely expected idiocy from a bunch of people who have the temerity to call themselves 'intelligent'.

'There are only so many ways you can tell us that you think we are mistaken in our criticism of Bush.'

Perhaps you should actually read what I am saying before responding. Most people recognize this as a prerequisite. Nowhere do I say anything about thinking anyone is wrong for criticizing Bush.

'I agree that Michael Moore manipulates and distorts the truth to present his prespective of reality. Yet before you call him "war profiteer, and general vulture of human misery" you should look into the current administrations cabinate for better examples of vultures and war profiteers.'

One of the things Bill Maher has been very rigorous in pointing out in the past has been the inability of people who think like you to understand holding two separate concepts at the same time, and still being able to function. It is not somehow lessening the blame on the Bush administration to point out what an idiot and opportunist Moore is. However it does concern me that you don't worry about Moore's underhanded and self-serving tactics just because you are so focused on Bush.

'After all, the letter is a very valid open question to those who voted for W in '04, so honestly, how does it feel?'

It's shameless self-promotion by Moore, and an obvious use of the suffering of others so he can say 'Gotcha!' and feel good about himself. Frankly it's rather like calling up the survivors of Hiroshima and saying 'So, how does it feel now, Mr. I-wanna-take-over-the-world?!? Huh? Burns, doesn't it?' What does this crap from Moore actually accomplish? The exact same as all of his other crap - NOTHING. Nothing except getting Moore lots of cash and attention.

'People always call him a liar, but no one can seem to point out where he's lied about something'

I cannot begin to describe how ignorant that statement is. Why don't you check your facts. Numerous people have done point-by-point critiques on his 'documentaries' and illustrated repeatedly his outright lies, misleading statements, uses of propaganda, and so on. He is no bastion of truth.

Michael Moore became famous making a documentary about the people of Flint, when he isn't from Flint. He never fed any money back into that economy. He calls himself a 'man of the working class', when he's from a rich suburb. He is a multi-millionaire because he knows he can sell a bunch of armchair liberals their own hateful little ideals and make them feel good about themselves - and he does it over and over.

Moore doesn't even have a philosophy or true message to push. He outright stated that BFC wasn't a pro-gun-control film, and that it really had no thesis. His films never have a point or an idea, and they are all completely dishonest and manipulative. He has repeatedly shown himself to be a complete ass in numerous interviews where people try to actually track down what he believes, because all he apparently believes in is being rich and disagreeing with people. And the amazing thing is that people leap up to defend him. Just like some hard-working guy stands up to say 'Bush is my president', you are deluded into thinking this guy actually believes what you believe or cares about what you care about, just because he says he does.

Moore is just a shill. He sees an opportunity to jump onto an existing cause and get his name out there and he does it. Which is why he is now coming forward, after all the intellectuals and true analysts have drawn their conclusions, and just parroting what they said. And because he is contentious and insulting you get all riled up. Give those righties their medicine, Moore!

He is the liberal Rush Limbaugh. And it amazes me that you people can, rightfully, hate Rush Limbaugh and recognize all the tricks he pulls and say people are stupid for following him, then blindly fall in line with this fat fuck who lives in a multi-million-dollar high-rise in New York when he repeats something he heard on the Daily Show or Bill Maher, or he read in the paper.

I know some idiot 1GM reader - lord knows there are a lot of them, every viewpoint has its dittoheads - who will insist that I am secretly trying to undermine their leftist viewpoint, secretly a fan of Bush, or some other bullshit. But to the contrary, I am someone who is tired of reactionaries and self-interested people running the dialogue. Michael Moore does NOTHING to further an actual dialogue, or to get people to do anything about anything. Between his lies and disinformation, his blatant flame-baiting and antagonism, and all of his other dishonest and self-serving methods, he is only making things worse by solidifying those on both sides of any issue he thinks will be profitable.

Maybe I am just deluding myself by thinking that it is possible to have an intellectual dialogue about any of the issues facing us today, but I refuse to believe that parroting fat assholes like Moore are the best we can hope for.

Bush Voter: I agree. How rude for someone to exploit a national day of mourning to further their own agenda.

bah humbug, that was a very sleazy attempt on your part to split hairs; I think you know very well what Jesus intent was when he states "Whatever you neglected to do unto one of these least of these, you neglected to do unto Me!"

Bush Voter, you deluded fool, you may not like the questions, but there are plenty of us out here wanting some answers; some insight into understand your incedibly delusional mindset. Michael Moore is not the only one... not by a long shot. And your non-answers, Bush Voter, that aren't worth a tinker's damn, not Moore's justifiably outraged questions. You basically haven't addressed the majority of them at all.

As to your insipid point about Bush's 2nd home; he is currently residing there is he not? Yes you are correct in stating that the White House belongs to the American people; and I think you know very well that Michael Moore knows that as well. The question is this: how much longer can the American people afford for him to continue to occupy it? The are a great many of us "landlords" that fear that much more of his occupancy will be at the peril of our nation.

None of your "answers" has even remotely addressed the legitimate reasons why so many of us are fearful of this folly of an administration continuing its self-destructive course. For those of you who don't like the outrage that goes along with the questions, that's too bad. Alot of us are outraged. You are just going to have to deal with it.

bah humbug, that was a very sleazy attempt on your part to split hairs; I think you know very well what Jesus intent was when he states "Whatever you neglected to do unto one of these least of these, you neglected to do unto Me!"

Bush Voter, you may not like the questions, but there are plenty of us out here wanting some answers; some insight into understand your incedibly delusional mindset. Michael Moore is not the only one... not by a long shot. And your non-answers, Bush Voter, that aren't worth a tinker's damn, not Moore's justifiably outraged questions. You basically haven't addressed the majority of them at all.

As to your insipid point about Bush's 2nd home; he is currently residing there is he not? Yes you are correct in stating that the White House belongs to the American people; and I think you know very well that Michael Moore knows that as well. The question is this: how much longer can the American people afford for him to continue to occupy it? The are a great many of us "landlords" that fear that much more of his occupancy will be at the peril of our nation.

None of your "answers" has even remotely addressed the legitimate reasons why so many of us are fearful of this folly of an administration continuing its self-destructive course. For those of you who don't like the outrage that goes along with the questions, that's too bad. Alot of us are outraged. You are just going to have to deal with it.

To be frank - I have a strong dislike for Michael Moore. He has a long history of using tragedies to turn a buck. He's no better in this regard than the "psychics" who supposedly can speak to the dead. He's exploiting the situation to make money and get attention and we definitly should call him on that - because it's the truth.

That said it would be incredibly arrogant to just write off everything he says based purely on that. He makes extremely good points here and we should acknowledge this. The FEMA staff and even Certoff himself have little to know experience doing the things we expect them to do. Instead they were selected purely on the basis of their partnership with Bush. We are no safer than we were pre-9/11 and to be frank we are even less prepared than before. We have turned critical government services to the private sector when we know this leads to catastrophe (hint:The depression was caused by an un-regulated private sector). Critical programs such as FEMA or the Army Corps of Engineers have been on the receiving end of budget cuts while the military budget just keeps getting bigger and bigger (because it takes a million dollar missle to kill a terrorist on the ground with a pickup and some pipe-bombs). Tax-cuts are being given to the people who need them the least in this nation while the rich just keep getting richer. Religious propaganda is being thrown around when it is completely opposed to the actual ideas of the religion itself (Pat Robertson people....I'm almost ashamed to call myself christian now).

Above all the actions of our President during the first few days of the crsis have no explanation what so ever. He flew off in the OPPOSITE direction to go make kissy face with some old people. Comming from a background with some ACTUAL EXPERIENCE in emergency management I can tell you that 3 days is the maximum amount of time it should take help to arrive. This wasn't a number we just arbitrarily picked either - that is the maximum amount of time a human can live without water. It is paramount of the rescue staff to arrive and handle the situation within 3 days because of this. Knowing this look at how long Bush took to get there and tell me what's wrong. That's right, it took 4 days for federal aid to even START arriving, much less actually achieve anything. That means that those people who had no water available died already. The more resourceful people raided now abandoned stores for water and food to survive to be able to wait longer - and when we have the audacity to call them "looters". Newsflash - if we arrived in the proper amount of time there would be no looting and far fewer dead.

This entire situation is sickening and it's only made worse by people who refuse to acknowledge what went wrong. The simple truth is that help took FAR TOO LONG to get there and even to this day is poorly coordinated and largely ineffective. It's ok to hate Michael Moore for being a fat sleazy jerk - but come to terms with the fact that he is indeed right on the money. Yeah, it's extremely sarcastic and downright insulting to sum but it's the truth.

Sometimes the truth sucks.

'Sick', you seem to have mistaken me for a dittohead. Far from it. But this is quite far from splitting hairs. Jesus simply did not say what Moore said he said, no ifs, ands, or buts. Moore has a tendency to do this kind of thing, and it only makes us look bad. The guy badly, dearly, needs an editor.

Norm, thanks for the Michael Moore posting. I agree with what he said. Every night when I come home from a busy day, the first thing I do is go to One Good Move. The second site I go to is Michael Moore’s. As I read his thoughts and issues that concern him, I get a good sense, as I do from this site, that MM’s heart is in the right place. There is no one on earth that everyone agrees with. I know people like Joe who are in the current 30 something percent that would rather look the other way and get worked up about the Michael Moore’s of this country. The ones who STILL think that a President who gets a blow job is much worse than lying our nation into a pointless, vicious, stupid fucking war, lining the pockets of his billionaire buddies who read the script and cash their War Profiteering checks and deplete our infrastructure leaving us vulnerable and weakened.

I agree with any one who raises their voice in opposition of this jack-ass cowboy corporate puppet president. We may not all agree with the exact details from the messager but more and more of us are agreeing with the message which is GET THIS ASSHOLE OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE NOW!

Also, millions of struggling families will be severely affected come Oct. 1 as the G.O.P.- corporate funded Chapter 7 Bankruptcy bill goes into effect. As the haves and have mores of this country continue to try and squeeze every last penny out of the rest of us, I’ll be doing all I can to support anyone who has any ideas regarding helping the less fortunate and then turning our attention to getting our country back!

@Bah Humbug

Honestly neither Moore nore Bush much less most of the radical religious groups really know what Jesus is about. When is the last time these people have heard of little things such as the golden rule or the beatitudes? They spend so much time harping on the ideas of judgement and hellfire that they miss the real point of Christianity - peace and harmony. Concepts like turn the cheek and love your enemy simply escape these people.

My response to all right-wingers and Michael Moore is this. Please kindly actually read the Bible and learn what the religion is really about. Do that and you are more than welcome to run around and talk about your interpretation all day. Until then - please kindly shut up.

Poindexter? So, is that what reading the bible entitles you to do? Go around telling people to shut up? I guess you and Bill O'Reilly are experts on peace and harmony! Let me ask you something, and this may be a soft ball but whack away... Can you explain the following "peace and harmony" quotes from the bible? Luke 19:27...Matthew 10:43 also 35-39 Matthew 10:21...Exodus 21:20...Exodus 21:7 (there are so many others) This book may work for you. For me it contradicts itself so many times that it just makes most people who claim to be experts on it as goofy as Pat Robertson. The world would be better off, in my opinion, if we listened to each others ideas more and out grew this ultimately useless, antiquated book.

@Jef

You'll note I never said that I myself live by it. My point was that these people are quick to spout out judgement rhetoric while completely missing the point in the first place.

Please don't attack me over the bible when I myself find it antiquated anyway. It's an ancient work with tons of human edits of history have have distilled (if not removed altogether) any influence the divine may or may not have had on it. Lest we forget the Church in essence had a comittee (a human one) deceide what to put in and what to cut out.

All that however does not change the fact that they are using it as ammunition that is directly contradictory to the ideals they supposedly live by. I'm suddenly reminded of the recent information that the late Chief Justice Rehnquist was a drug addict. The hypocrisy that exists is so overwhelming it's amazing anything gets done at all. Wait, New Orleans - that's right NOTHING gets done at all.

You're always welcome to express ideas - but you need to really understand what you are talking about before you should parade around acting as if you are God's divine messanger. I really question if these people have read the bible at all? If they had they certainly would have seen the contradictory nature of it, and if they are good Christians they would summaize that only really a few sections are of value (Beatitudes and what not) and essentially write up the rest as being mythology. Wasn't it Penn Juliette (the speaking half of Bullshit - that is the Showtime show) that said that the fastest way to become an atheist was to read the bible?

Oh well, cookie for you for actually reading what I wrote anyway - I think that's the first time someone actually responded to what I wrote heh.

You know, I'm a progressive. Voted Kerry, helped out a little on his campaign, spent a weekend in Crawford supporting Cindy, etc. But folks, Michael Moore is one of the worst things to come out of the left in a long time. I used to like Michael Moore. I liked Roger and Me, I loved it when he confronted the CEO of Nike, I watched his show, I read his books. And then I saw Bowling for Columbine. I really liked Bowling for Columbine, but after I saw it, I did a funny thing -- I checked out all the facts that Moore presented in that film. And man, I got pissed off. I got pissed off because he manipulated the truth absolutely as far as he could without lying outright.

Just... cheap stuff. For example, he made out Charlton Heston to be a racist. Charlton Heston, a man who put his career on the line to help the civil rights movement (before it was fashionable) and who was friends with MLK. Crap like that. The kind of editing "mistakes" that don't happen by accident. The kind of manipulation that would have the left screaming bloody murder if the right was doing it. And I've seen it in everything he's done since then. Michael Moore is a deceiver. I understand that that's hard to take -- hey, he tricked me -- but it's the truth.

That's the problem with Michael Moore. The man has no credibility, and the right is keenly aware of that fact. When Michael Moore says something -- even if it's the truth -- it's going to sound to the right like it's a lie. Get that? He discredits our side. He discredits our arguments, just by repeating them. Take this to heart: When Michael Moore sides with us, it hurts us.

Don't believe me? Don't believe Poindexter or joe or anyone else here who's telling you that? Then listen to the Bush supporters like Bush Voter, who obviously didn't even think about Moore's letter before refuting it. Still don't believe me? Then listen to Jon Stewart. Even Jon Stewart has made jokes about how Moore discredits whatever side he takes.

I know the right drives you crazy, but remember: these are the people we have to reach. We have to convince them to see our side, because they hold all the cards right now, and there isn't going to be a credible investigation or impeachment proceeding without them. Michael Moore makes it harder to do that. And, frankly, I don't think he has much character -- I wouldn't want to be associated with him on principle.

I know it's hard to swallow, but it's the truth: Michael Moore hurts our side.

Until then - please kindly shut up.

Ah, Poindexter. Glad to see you're doing what you can to make this comments page sound like that of the Freepers.

I think there's a couple things to be learned from this. 1) Michael Moore can be bad for the left. In the early days, his documentaries were more like exposés intent on showing the viewer injustices going on in America. Today, his documentaries, and his letters come off as directed personal attacks on the right and that has permanently compromised unbiased neutral image that some film makers try to maintain. Every time Moore makes an appearance, people who were already going to vote democrat cheer, and people who were on the republican side get more angry and people in the middle start to see him and the left as shit disturbers. 2) What happened in New Orleans is bigger than American Christians turning their backs on those in needs. It's your have/have no society at it's worst. Yes, many of the rich white folk in the area are born agains, but this is not about the bible, or proper religious doctrine at all. This is about "me first, and fuck the rest". If you want to see an example of this prevailing American ideology, look no further than some conservative blogs (beaglexp.com etc etc). They actually argue after all this happened that it wasn't the governments job to help people. Herbert Hoover anyone? Anyhow, all this back and forth over whether or not people should have voted for Bush. I don't think they should have but I can count the number of republicans that admit it when they're wrong on one hand. Democrats have to understand that these people actually think they're right and that they are saving America from some socialist enemy within.
Finally? Why do conservatives win? Because they are better at converting simple people. I don't think the left has a problem picking up informed voters, it's the dimwits that swing elections. People on the left are quite elitist about being intelligent. Many influencial people on the right, make it a weekly ritual to bring uninformed, unintelligent people to Jesus. It's only one more step to becoming republican. Some of you will dismiss this but I think the right owns religion, and in essence, heaven. So, lefties, it's a tough fight to win over the heartland but it isn't going to work with letters like these from Michael Moore. This will only harden their resolve.

I find it funny that Michael Moore can stir up emotions so much that these neurotic commenters in here spit out emotional bile in greater quantities than substantive criticism.

Voltaire would applaud Moore. No one likes a social critic who hits raw nerves as much as Moore does. America, above any country in the world, loves to believe in its national myths and fairy tales, and anyone who tries to debunk them is immediately hated and reviled. America simply cannot stand to be criticized.

If Moore's work was as obviously mendacious as his critics like to charge, then why would they get so pissed off? Why spend so much time debunking him if he's such a big fucking liar?

I'll tell you why: Because his talking points are dead-on correct; his facts may sometimes need a liitle axle grease to get a square peg through a round hole, but his thesis is usually quite sound. Part of his shtick is over-the-top theatrics and a little disingenuous grandstanding, and of course his entire persona drips of faux sanctimony, but one thing I admire about Michael Moore is that his concerns are for the citizenry--the people--and his attacks on corporations, bad government, and dangerous anti-democratic special interest groups like the NRA are well grounded in fact.

America just hates criticism. Being the wealthiest and most powerful nation in the world has not helped the fact so many American citizens are terribly insecure. The other night when Kurt Vonnegut called America the richest, most powerful, and yet the dumbest nation on Earth, he was absolutely correct. How could a country that claims to be so enlightened cling to so many phony religions and specious philosophies (such as "Intelligent Design" and free market economic)? Why do charlatans and demagogues pollute our public debate in such great numbers?

Please do not compare Michael Moore to Rush Limbaugh. Limbaugh is a racist, misogynistic, pro-corporatist, anti-democratic, anti-citizenry demagogue who gets paid by right-wing corporations and think tanks to be a shill for their sleazy causes; he's not a free thinker, he's a hand puppet used to promote hate and discord among the working classes. He is certainly no man of the people even though he drapes himself in the cloak of populism. He has done much to undermine people’s faith in the power of democracy by helping to promote anti-government rhetoric. Anyone who hates government is an enemy of the people, as government is our only legitimate source of power we the people own in this country. It is one thing to hate sleazy politicians and bureaucrats; Limbaugh and his gang want to undermine the idea of government as a legitimate extension of power for the people. They’d prefer less government so that the American people have less power and say in how things are run, thus making them mere subjects and not citizens with a legitimate stake in the decision-making process.

Moore is a grandstanding, self-absorbed egomaniac, but his cause is legitimate. He tries to speak for the people. Unlike Limbaugh or Hannity or O’Reilly, Moore hasn’t been bought out by corporations or special interest groups, and is therefore not a front man for corporatism and anti-government, free market capitalists. He is not selling the citizenry down the road for cheap profit or to promote a phony and disingenuous ideology, philosophy, or religion. He’s merely having fun poking holes in bullshit American mythology and the sleaziness of corporate America, especially how corporate America loves to usurp power from the citizenry.

Moore does not hold public office or answer to a corporate boss; he’s a free thinker and entertainer who uses his immense talent to try to do some good. Sometimes he goes way over the top with his phony histrionics and grandstanding, but as long as he fights for the people I admire his work.

i really am amazed by a lot of these reponses-- i think michael moore helped to wake up a large portion of america-- how well did his movie 9/11 do? i think a lot of people liked it-- i think he can back up what he says-- i think he has the balls to write a letter to the president and then write a letter to the folks that voted for the president-- michael moore knows that the best way to make americans aware is to shove it right in front of them-- his sarcasm? mild and always polite-- i think the reason most people don't like the man is because he's right--

I am amazed at the comtempt Bush voters have... they just love "their" president because we have not been attacked in 4 years. BULLSHIT

DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW LONG IT TOOK AL-QAEDA TO PLAN AN ATTACK TO THE TWIN TOWERS? IT WAS YEARS, OF COURSE THEY WON'T PULL OFF ANOTHER AMAZING ATTACK LIKE SEPT 11 IN ONLY 4 YEARS, THEY NEED MORE TIME, OF COURSE THEY ARE THINKING AND PROBABLY PLANNING HOW TO DO IT AGAIN. BUT IT WILL HAPPEN AND THE ONLY REGRET I HAVE IT PROBABLY WONT COME UNDER BUSH'S WATCH, WILL THAT MAKE HIM A HERO. NO!!!!!!! HE IS NOT THE ONE MAKING US SAFE, HE IS LUCKY ENOUGH THAT AL QAEDA CAN NOT PULL ANOTHER SEPT 11, EASILY.

i would disagree i think our government is quite capable of pulling off another 9/11 anytime with the help of some "terrorists"

Just when I thought people were being rational and recognizing Moore for what he is:

'Voltaire would applaud Moore'

Funny that you missed one of Voltaire's many key statements: 'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.' Moore is one of the people making a legion of self-obsessed armchair liberals believe absurdities. What atrocities would you commit in the name of your belief?

'No one likes a social critic who hits raw nerves as much as Moore does.'

Another outright lie. People don't dislike Moore because he is a 'social critic', but because he only 'hits raw nerves', and only does it for profit and personal gain. Jon Stewart is a social critic. Bill Maher is a social critic. Hell, even Noam Chomsky is a social critic, if an ineffective and rather uninformed one. Moore is a propaganda artist and a profiteer.

'one thing I admire about Michael Moore is that his concerns are for the citizenry'

Really? That certainly explains these quotes from your fat master:

'I'm a millionaire, I'm a multi-millionaire. I'm filthy rich. You know why I'm a multi-millionaire? 'Cause multi-millions like what I do.' - So he's an entertainer, and a capitalist.

'White people scare the crap out of me.' - He is willing to pander.

'[Americans] are possibly the dumbest people on the planet' - He is willing to deride the very people he claims 'love what he does', to make more money by selling them and the world a self-hating image.

'We need to change our ethic and aspire to be more Canadian-like' - More pandering (and why insecure Canadians love the guy)

He's the movie-making equivalent of a shock jock, saying things that piss people off to make t-shirts and bumper stickers for people like you.

'America just hates criticism.'

Hardly. The facts show that we love criticism. We are possibly the most self-critical nation on the planet, and in the history of the planet. We are self-monitoring, we have free press, we have satire shows on which people stomp on dolls of our president, where our presidents are routinely depicted as idiots and being incapable of doing the job.

America loves criticism and we are quite capable of laughing at ourselves. What we hate are phony people, or people who make asses of themselves. Moore is both.

If America hates criticism so much, explain the popularity of Jon Stewart's show.

'Anyone who hates government is an enemy of the people'

Hmm. That calls for some more Moore quotes:

'I think our government knows where [Osama] is and I don't think we're going to be capturing him or killing him any time soon.' 'These bastards who run our country are a bunch of conniving, thieving, smug pricks who need to be brought down and removed and replaced with a whole new system that we control.'

And the most treasonous and idiotic statement by Moore:

'The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not 'insurgents' or 'terrorists' or 'The Enemy.' They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow -- and they will win.'

God bless those 'minutemen' 'revolutionaries' who BLOW UP THEIR OWN KIDS!

What a great guy.

'Moore does not hold public office or answer to a corporate boss; he’s a free thinker and entertainer who uses his immense talent to try to do some good.'

Of course he does. But only for himself. Which is what makes him dangerous.

Even Samuel L. Jackson was feeding people after the hurricane. Moore writes a baiting 'open letter' full of facts and points already discovered and written by better thinkers. What a hero.

The fact that you put all this together Joe, but reduce yourself to name calling really hurts your credibility. Sure Michael Moore is fat, but what's the relevance?

Voltaire: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. Who provides absurdities? "Iraq is directly tied to 9/11", "Iraq has WMDs", "Nobody suspected that the levees would break". There are many more and they have all produced atrocities.

You slam Moore for making money for the work he does, but the public voluntarily go to see his movies and to buy his books. What about Haliburton? Did the public have a say in handing out these plum reconstruction contracts to this firm that Dick Cheney is so closely related to? Would you apply your criticism about profiteering in this case?

What do Canadians have to do with any of this? The right is always looking for a way to belittle other countries because it deflects attention from the mess in the their own country.

I think one of the worst remarks you made was "EVEN Samuel L Jackson was feeding people after the hurricane". Why EVEN? Is there some reason why Samuel L Jackson would not be helping the people? What is unique about Samuel L Jackson? Oh I get it. Even a black guy is helping out. Real nice Joe.

The funny part about all this is that I don't even agree with Michael Moore's confrontational methods. I think it's great that he puts the information out there but waving it in people's face that they fucked up by electing Bush would only make them elect him for a 3rd term if that were constitutionally possible.

Still, his portrayal of what is happening in America is important, and I don't think our right wing society has the right to silence people like him, or Joe for that matter no matter how little you agree with their opinion. Leave the brown shirts in the past please.

Anyone who can tick off a guy like Joe can't be all bad. This is what I love most about Moore. Every word that Joe writes crticizing simply attests to Moore's power. Keep screaming, Joe. By the way, I am assuming that Joe is some sort of body builder since he has commented so many times on Moore's physique. Remind me to fire Michael as my personal trainer.

40 posts, and again all the pro-administration side can offer for debate is an attack on Moore's character. Put Moore aside and answer the damn question.

Do you feel your vote in Bush, in the face of all that has transpired on his watch, was well placed?

Normally I do not deconstruct the arguments of most blog commenters because they are so illogical and stupid that they don’t deserve to be treated with any sort of intellectual discourse on my part.

However, with this “Joe” person (another BRAVE anonymous poster, I might add), I'll bite and answer your comments because you are an idiot and I want to explain why you are:

1) Joe is an idiot for using Voltaire's quote out of context:

Funny that you missed one of Voltaire's many key statements: 'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.' Moore is one of the people making a legion of self-obsessed armchair liberals believe absurdities. What atrocities would you commit in the name of your belief?

And what atrocities, pray tell, are we liberals committing in the name of Michael Moore? Are we rounding up fundamentalist Christians in rail cars and sending them to death camps? No. After the Enron scandal broke, did we riot in the streets and burn down Kenneth Lay's house after we tortured him, his wife, and his children and hung them in his front lawn? No. After watching "Bowling for Columbine," did we go out and shoot members of the NRA? Nope. We might have laughed at poor old Charlton Heston, but we certainly didn’t physically harm the old prick, now did we?

Speaking of Voltaire's statement 'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,' how about such absurdities as:

1) Iraq has a nuclear weapons program! 2) Iraq has weapons of mass destruction! 3) Any day Iraq will use these to hit America! 4) Iraq was directly involved in 9/11!

Now THESE absurdities did, in fact, lead to atrocities. We used them to invade, conquer, and govern Iraq.

“Joe is an idiot” score for misusing Voltaire's quote out of context: 10 (on a scale of 0-10, 0 being a smart debater, 10 being a complete tool.)

2) Joe is an idiot for not understanding that only liberals don't mind criticism, not "America."

If America hates criticism so much, explain the popularity of Jon Stewart's show.

I don't think Jon Stewart and the Daily Show are popular in red states or conservative circles. In fact, conservatives call any critic of Bush or the war in Iraq a “traitor.” You, in fact, employ that yourself.

Joe's idiot score here: 9

3) Joe takes what people say out of context and uses it to promote a fallacious argument based on the deliberate (or stupid) misuse.

For instance, my original quote was the following:

Anyone who hates government is an enemy of the people, as government is our only legitimate source of power we the people own in this country. It is one thing to hate sleazy politicians and bureaucrats...

Joe, idiot, quotes Moore out of context to my meaning, because the quotes he cites SUPPORT my meaning:

'I think our government knows where [Osama] is and I don't think we're going to be capturing him or killing him any time soon.'

'These bastards who run our country are a bunch of conniving, thieving, smug pricks who need to be brought down and removed and replaced with a whole new system that we control.'

Joe, he is speaking of sleazy politicians IN government, not the government itself. Government in the context I mean is the constitutional structure, not the fools inhabiting its upper echelons, and I am sure that is what Moore means to. His goal is not to elimnate government, but to rid government of the assholes running it. NOT the same thing.

Joe's idiot points here: 10

4) Joe is an idiot for calling the following statement by Moore "treason":

'The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not 'insurgents' or 'terrorists' or 'The Enemy.' They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow -- and they will win.'

How is that treason? He is stating an opinion about how he sees the situation in Iraq. He's not donating money to the Iraqi insurgency of even lauding them; he is simply stating a fact as he sees it.

That is not treason. That is FREE SPEECH.

Joe's idiot points here: 10

5) And finally, Joe is an idiot for this hilarious statement:

Of course he does. But only for himself. Which is what makes him dangerous.

How exactly, I ask, is Michael Moore dangerous? We have established he does not incite violence with his art. So how, exactly, is he dangerous?

What a silly and utterly baseless accusation. If you fear humorists and entertainers, how do you feel about people who really do harm others, like corporate managers at Enron who cheat millions of Americans out of money, or national leaders who take us to war on false premises?

For fuck's sake, dude, your perspective is so twisted by your hatred of Moore you cannot even make one sensible argument about him. You make him out to be Chè or Mao here, as if he's a well-armed rebel with a massive following of armed insurgents at his beck and call to destroy the entire social fabric of America.

How dare you demand "intelligent discourse" when you employ every absurd perversion of logic imaginable to promote your rather obvious hatred for Moore, who has personally done you no harm.

Michael Moore is a personal trainer and we don't get French benefits who would have thought. :)

I too, get home from work, and check onegoodmove daily. Thanks, all of you for the great posts/rants and all of the interesting and funny videos I see here.

While not a big fan of Michael Moore (not because of his weight issue), I liked a majority of this letter. We(non-republicans for lack of a better term) will never change neocons minds on issues. Mr. Moore realizes this too. His open letters' to the President and to Bush Voters were to keep the issue in the spotlight. It has helped to do that. I cringed a little at some of the jabs in the most recent letter but then thought, "well "those" voters hate him anyway.

In any case I find Mr. Moore important to America because he can fire up people from both sides. That fire in itself can lead to change.

You people are idiots, and transparent ones. Critique Michael Moore for being an insensitive, money-hungry gasbag and you say I'm dodging the issue of Bush. Say he doesn't do anything, and mention someone that does, and you insinuate that I'm a racist. No wonder you like the fat asshole - you're fat assholes just like him.

Let me just tell you this: nothing has ever changed because somebody bought a 'you're stupid' bumper sticker, or yelled in somebody's face. The proof that Michael Moore doesn't change a damn thing is that Bush won re-election. YOU are part of the problem. And just like Bush, just like O'Reilly, just like Limbaugh, you are so firmly convinced that you're the solution that you forgot the important thing: the dialogue.

Keep parroting and dittoing and buying his books. You think my laughing at you is bad? Imagine what that fat fuck is doing in his multi-million-dollar penthouse, selling you your own anger. Over and over and over.

You gullible, sad people. Pretending you're actually accomplishing anything by reading Michael Moore and putting up nasty comments on bulletin boards. Maybe clicking the ad to the right and buying an 'I hate Bush' t-shirt. That will show the guys at the coffee house! Me and my iPod are SMARTER than you!

Meanwhile in Washington it's business as usual, because you're too busy feeling good about yourselves to do anything.

Joe, your incessant babbling and lack of substantive arguments makes you the biggest idiot here.

We get it: you hate Michael Moore.

We don't have to feel like you do, you angry and confused moron.

Try deep breathing or some other form of anger management.

People have concludent that Joe is stupid, now we can conclude he is infantile.

Btw, anyone else pickup any info on the partisan zero bid reconstruction contracts being handed out for the rebuilding effort? Guess who instantly got a no bid contract? Haliburton.

Makes you wonder if they let the levee burst on purpose...

I don't feel good about it. I regret voting for what I thought was the lesser of two evils.

But I don't appreciate Micheal Moore rubbing my nose in it. Do you guys really like him? I truly don't get the appeal.

To anon: I can see how Michael Moore rubs you the wrong way. He is very direct and at times insulting to people who he thinks let evil ppl take over the country. I don't particularly like Michael Moore but his films are well done. There are only a couple areas I've ever found I didn't like in his films.

The first was portraying Iraq as peaceful before the Iraqi war but this was not the case and we all know it. It was obviously more peaceful then than now but his version of Iraq was a bit too nice.

The second would be in bowling for Columbine when he depicted Canada devoid of violence and people just leave their doors unlocked. Yeah, it's safer and there's fewer guns but everyone locks their doors up here. Little things like that can make Michael Moore seem like he's pushing the truth. But these are tiny things in the face of giant truths that he has brought to the viewers.

I think blue collar america would appreciate his earlier work. He spent a significant amount of time trying to protect American jobs, taking on corporations for exporting work to China etc etc.

R.D.-----

I only have seen Bowling for Columbine. And I just don't think you can blame guns for the Columbine shooting. Yes, Yes I know they used guns but if they had made bombs out of the anarchist cookbook would Micheal Moore have done a film on how we should censor books that we find scary. I think there were alot of contributing reasons to Columbine - like how the shooter's were on anti-depressants, etc.

Although I do agree with one of Moore's points - our culture is very violent. But I don't think it's because guns exist.

I am a lover of all of our Bill of Rights. Someday, if things get bad enough, even liberals might be glad for our 2nd admendment rights.

Oh yeah, by the way-

Even though I regret who I voted for, that doesn't mean I would of actually of voted for Kerry. If I had it to do all over again - I would of done a write-in vote maybe for Mickey Mouse.

P.S. Norm-you wouldn't believe how many Libertarians enjoy your site - I especially like your links on evolution and religion. And even I have to admit, John Stewart is pretty funny although I probaly wouldn't go out of my way to watch on Comedy Channel.

After reading the comments here, with Joe and Bush Voter criticizing Michael Moore, and Bush Voter being insulted as a "deluded fool" with the redundant slur as having an "incedibly delusional mindset", and Joe and everyone else being labeled idiots of one degree or another, I would rate the degree of imbecility on this one page as Not an Idiot: Bush Voter; Borderline Idiot: Joe (for being a borderline Conservative); Wally Idiot Michael Moore; Goof-Dong Idiots: All the Other Posters; Profound Softhead Simpleton Idiot: The Author of the Rules, ("Rules: Criticize ideas? Yes. Criticize people for holding those ideas? No.")

And still not one single answer to the questions posed by Michael Moore.

That is a testament in itself. That is why Michael Moore is so valuable. The questions deserve some serious thought. Even if those who voted for Bush can't bring themselves to answer them directly here, there is still hope that they will wrestle with the angels of doubt and righteous anger in private, if nothing else, for the sake of their own consciences and psyches,

But I think it is pretty clear why many people don't like Michael Moore; somebody else alluded to it earlier. He dares to ask the questions that demand answers and he doesn't do it in some namby pamby nicey nice way. He is in fact a provacateur despite the denial made about it earlier upthread. Outrage and anger is sometimes the only way to get people's attention and wake them up.

And despite the denial upthread of this fact, also, it is absolutely true that many people in this country cannot take criticism; that is why it is so easy for political hacks to whip certain segments of the population into a frenzy when the make a point of calling anyone who questions the president, this administration or some of the most outrageous policies ever presented to this country, as "traitors", treasonous", and imply that it weakens our country, our troops or is an insult to "the office of the president".

It takes alot of real live guts and courage to be the lightning rod, the focus and the vocal source of those very unpopular questions. You can deny it all you want, but the truth is obvious. What people don't like about Michael Moore is the fact that he dares to ask those questions without apology, And the fact that in doing so he has spurred an otherwise lethargic population into taking a stand and adding their voices.

About a year ago, I was having a conversation at work. A mix of Democrats, Republicans and undecideds were talking about Fahrenheit 9/11. A friend of mine, a young man of about 21, was agreeing with my Republican friends that “Fahrenheit 9/11 was filled with lies”. I asked him if he had seen it and he had not. He also watched Fox News and didn’t know what I was talking about when I said it was a tool of the Republicans. I asked him to come over and watch it with me and after viewing it he could then point out all the lies. I watched his reactions as he watched. His jaw dropped! Afterwards he was enlightened!

From then on, at the office discussions, he was the most vociferous attack dog against Bush! He even told me when he would go to parties, he would point out to his young friends how Bush is fucking up this country.

I would imagine this scenario has occurred across America. This is an example of Mr. Moore’s success. Sure, go ahead and disagree with parts of it, but the footage of Bush reading MY PET GOAT while America was under attack is unforgettable and unforgivable! That scene alone proves he either knew the attack was coming or he was a complete idiot for just sitting there for so long!

And to all the Joe’s out there, if you didn’t have Secretary of State J. Kenneth Blackwell, who administered the Ohio presidential balloting while serving as co-chair of the state's Bush-Cheney campaign you’d be here ranting and raving about President Kerry!

regardless of whether or not his points are valid, this letter is just too obnoxious. stick to attacking bush, not the voters.

But think about it. Who's stupider? Hitler, or the people that followed Hitler. Same shit new millennia.

Removing Bush isn't going to solve anything as long as America stays stupid and with the ideology of being above all other nations.

The Bush voters and part of the problem too. So, how do you feel?

RE: a previous post about BFC, the movie was not about guns per se, rather it was about a culture of fear in american society.

Bush is an idiot and anybody who thinks he is not should have their head examined. We are the stupid bastards who stand still while bush sticks it up our ass..................