This has been a major burr under my blanket for some time. The Social Security Trust fund is sacred. Not only because it stores economic value to aid me and some of the other old gezzers during retirement, but because it stores and reflects public trust. Which as we all know is in short supply.

The public trust has gone down the drain for decades in the media, the government, in business, the election process and so on.

The pusblic trust has little left to trust in these days except the SS. Its really like the last bastion of human sympathy. But if you let the Axis of Greed have their way it will be distrooyed along with what presious little dignity the former USA has, now Bush & Co.

To be sure, there is a projected shortfall, but good lord, its 50 years down the road, and the funds could easily be raised by rolling back The Invented Presidents unnecessary tax cuts benefiting the top 1% bracket in this country.

The alternatives to riskey privite accounts (which no one would hardely call a solution for a shortfall) are to alter the payroll contribution structure (could work depending on whose contributions we alter), increase the federal deficit(not wise since we're in dept to our azz ) lower benefits (not humane- which dose not concern the present evildoers) or raise the retirement age (not fair), we used to have jobs instead of cell phones in the old days and drive crappy old junkers. Most of us had at least part time if not full time jobs by the time we were 13 to 15. We are fucking tired!

Anyway, the American Progress Action Fund reports, "During the next 75 years, the total shortfall for SS amounts to just 0.4 percent of the GDP Meanwhile during that same period, the Invented President's tax cuts just for the top percent of earners (a group of folks whose average income exceeds $1 Million) will cost 0.6 percent of GOP. I know, I cheaked. So our Ruler's tax cuts for the wealthiest equal one and a half times the SS gap. So anyone other than an 8 year old Republican, this would be insane! Americans currently do not all pay the same percentage of their income towards the Trust Fund. Instead, all Americans pay 12.4% on the first 87,900 (including employers matching contributions of the workers 6.2%, which workers presumable still pay for by having lower wages.

What this means is a worker earning 87,900 a year puts aboutr 10,000 towards SS, and so dose someone earning a million dollars.

Private brokers at firms like Charles Scwab are pised to make unseemly hundreds of billions of dollars in ongoing transaction fees. Humm...Maybe thats why the neo-cons push so hard.

The net present value of such payment would $940 Billion (over 75 years) . These expenses amount to more than 25% of the existing deficit in SS over the same time. These fees would be the largest windfall gain in the American financial history.

Oh I now I get it, now I see. Fuck the poor, more for the rich and take care of our dear banker friends, screw the working poor.

Social Secuity is one of the most efficienly run government programs, so I understand how it must get on the bastards nerves until they destory it as well.

Less than 0.6 cents of every dollar paid out in SS goes to pay administration cost. The Invented President SS commission extimated under their system of individual accounts, 5 cents of every dollar would go to pay administrative cost. Are you getting any of this?

The point of Social Security is to have a guarantee that no matter what happens, short of getting nuked, with our shaky economy, that retired seniors will have minimun necessary funding to take care of their basic needs.

Colummist Molly Irins ( the only woman I ever really loved) wrote in 2001, "You know perfectly well a lot of people will get ripped off it they control their own retirement money. Older people are particularly vulmerable to con artist"...... Think only the feeble minded will lose? WHo lost money in high tech? Wasn't it all those brillian young hotshots we kept hearing about? Wasn't it the NASDAQ that went down 60 percent?"

So let me preempt your argument by saying, yes, I agree that working familes should have a stake in the economy, their government, in their communitiy, but we can't even have fair elections so I know it very unwise to mess with SS for that purpose.

Why not a system that increase the responsibliliy of the highest wage-earners, which would simply create greater proportionality of contributions per-earning between all workers?

If the neo-cons have their way, vast amount of additional deficit borrowing are expected to be required to pay for the potentially 1 trillion, and some say many trillion more, for the "transitions" to soical security private accounts.

These "transition costs" at hand refer to the fact, if this unacceptable legislations were to be unstopped, then for each current worker who chose to "invest" a portion of their contribution in stocks instead of SS, the federal gov. would have to borrow money to pay for existing retirees benefits.

The Ruler and his handlers are just going to ignor the cost of privatizing the system. They're just going to ignore it by taking the cost "off-buget, or as one of the plan's propoments at Cato Institute explained, the White House economist will use "creative accounting" to hide enormous holes in future bdgets (anyone old enough to remember the Saving and Loan fisaco?)

So I suppose by now you can tell I'm not smiling. This is what the regime has in store for the middle class, red and blue states.

Higher taxes, esploding deficits, and the end of health coverage as we know it and the never ending war.

Never mind that Social Security is actually solvent and supports millions of Americans . Although it faces challenges from the baby boomer generation, SS has always been self-sustianing and has actually been tapped as a source of revenue for other gov. programs.

Never mind how many commuity colleges, even with slashed funding mangage to rovide a quality education, raise money and stay within budget.

Never mind a recent federal study showing that in Texas 98 per ent of the public schools met state performance standards, while only 66 percent of Charter Schools did.

Just concider the Big Dib as a poster child for what happens when "big gov" steps aside.

Years ago, when it was reported that Bechel?Parsons Brinckerhoff both executed and nonitored the preliminary design of the Big Dig, my alrm bells rang. With little interest in reining in costs, the price of the Big Dig escalated by millions, creating the greatest overrun in the history of US public works. Now I hear the project itself may be seriously flawed.

How did this occur? There may be blame enough to go around, but let us remember, a seriers of Republicans governors--Weld, Cellucci, and Swift, all firm believers in privatization allowed Bechtel to run tis own show.

WHen tow member of the Massachusettls Turnpike Authority, Jordan Levy and CHristy Mihos protested, governor Swift moved to fire them.

In short the Big Dig ia a classic example of private corporations abusing public funds for privite profit.

As you well know this happens all the time with military procurement. Yet now, when politicians choose to vote against overpriced military equipment or faulty missile defense programs, they are branded as anti defense or even unpatriotic. Why is that?

There are a number of sound policies that would truly allow working familys to hve an enpowering stake in society. To be exact, the universal health care, increasing the minimum wage, and enacting the Bring America Home legislation, would give many working familes the basic toolsa nd resources to both work hard and fell part of a community. I won't even bother to get into the the tax breaks for the rich here.

But the opposite of Social Security is Individual Risk. Todays working family is isolated, alienated and struggling. The GOP's wish to destroy SS is not merely about linning the pockets of their corporate banker friends, but its's about expanding the risks faced by individual citizins, knowing full well the poor and disadvantaged fall most often through an unraveling safety net. So much for what Jesus would do. I hereby forbid anyone to disagree with me, now everyone sign they're oath on my can of Cisco.

PS. All typo Gestops, and spelling police, fuck off and have a nice day.

They already got a big chunk of my retirement whent the 401k lost most of its value. Now they just want the last chunk of it. Having looted everything else the public owns (budget surpluses, our national resources and our collective goodwill come to mind), they're after the one thing that's left.

Greedy assholes.

It blows my mind to watch our country being destroyed on every front from the bush cartel. While maintaining so much support from so many. It has become clear to me that bush&co are out to destroy the United States. What I don't understand is why. Though I often dispair. I will never lose faith that they will be brought down in shame. And held to account by the American people. POWER TO THE PEOPLE!

If the last two elections haven't made you lose faith in the American people, I don't know what will. ABANDON SHIP - MOVE TO EUROPE

MinnObserver - May I ask how "they " got your retirement when "you" are the one who chose to invest in an overblown stock market devoid of fundamentals driven to perilous heights by companies like Pets.com that had a higher market cap than GM at it's peak? My parents never put a dime in the Nasdaq becasue they couldn't process how vapor corporations could have such valuations and condequently they didn't lose anything. It seems to me that the criticism listed here is all about how people make poor choices and thus they shouldn't have the right to make those choices for themselves. I lost a bunch of dough when the markets fell as well, and you know who's fault it was? Mine. Mine alone - all mine. It's called personal responsibility, and I am responsible for making that bad choice. On the SS front, those who don't understand the markets could choose to put the private portion of their contributions into a money market account that has no transaction fees and risk nothing. If they choose to do something else, isn't that their right with their money, just like One had the right and I had the right, regardless of whether we were right about the choice?

http://www.socialsecurity.org/pubs/ssps/ssp-32es.html

Hey! Your country has been hijacked by psychopaths. Why can't you get this? Why do you react with surprise and outrage at each new piece of evidence, as if you imagined that psychopaths could be trusted to maintain or advance civilization? Didn't you know that before? Wake up!

Hey remember when the question was posed, who would you rather have a beer with? Which only those suffering from Dementia would even ask, I mean considering this was an election for the fucking White House, not a country club. How about this question:

Who would you rather have pack your parachute? Fuckhead or Kerry?

Who would you trust with your money in other words?

white buffalo I have visions of you roasting on a open fire, will I rot in hell?

Buffalo is a delicious, low fat replacement for beef. We highly encourage its consumption.

I also hear they are suprisingly easy to kill. (It was on the Simpsons, so it must be true.) ;-P

WB your Christian compassion is shining through again. You seem to have a case toward those less fortunate than you. How much retirement could a man save struggling to feed his children on say Wal-mart wages. What about those who have lost jobs in the last four years. And those who are sure to join them in the next four. Will their saving see them through another four years of gwb's poor choices. 2005 will be the first year in 50 according to the U.S. Department of Agriculture. That America will not turn an agricultural trade surplus. gwb has taken all quotas of imported textiles. Opening the door for a flood of cheap clothing from China, India and others countries. At the rate gwb is destroying Americas industrial footing. Who will have a job four years from now to pay or save anything. When that day comes if you by chance still have a job or your mom and dad will feed you. Go and tell those men with hungry mouths to feed they made poor choices. I garantee they will bar-b-que your buffalo ass.

Bubba - Take a chill pill. There's not less money per person under a 50% privatized program, there is just a different distribution of it between the controlling parties. I believe the poor can make good choices. I don't think they're poor becausue they are morons. I fully understand the deck is stacked against opportunity for certain minority groups and those lacking capital period. I believe they should have the right to decide whether they want to educate themselves about the markets and participate in them with some of this money that will be taken from their cehck regardless of whether they have any control. You want to be their daddy.
And on the Christian compassion front, I'll put up my non-profit donations as a percentage of my income against yours any day, my friend. Any day.....

No, MM, here's the true story of the white buffalo. wb starts entrepeneurial company with two friends using no borrowing, only own capital at only his own risk. white buffalo and friends grow their company to 35 employees, 1 of which has turned over in the last 3 years because white buffalo pays much higher than market salaries, gives everyone as much vacation as they need with the expectation that they will get their work done under their own drive. wb sells his company to a public company and everyone gets a piece of the action. so how is wb like enron? the problem you folks who have never risked or accomplished anything have is that you think anyone who has anything had it given to them. i graduated with honors from a top university and i worked 70 hours a week to build my business, treating every employee like family the whole time. let's hear yuour story of "money where your mouth is"' mm? everyone is listening....

Oh, and MM, nothing in life is "free". Someone pays in all those little socialist countries you list above.

Suck Ann Coulters dick! God told me to hate you and I only pray that they draft young repupblicans by the thousands. You got yours, so fuck everyone else, Yeah I know you.

This article might be of interest to you:

http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?Id=1686

regards

how do you get "f* everyone else" from the description of how the people that work in my company are treated? you write a nice "i love folks" rant, but i divert my own profits from my pocket to my employees. that's real life. you, you're a paper advocate until you have something to offer where you give up your own well being for others. we're still listening to hear about your expericenes doing so, mr marx......hmmmm...is that the sound of crickets i hear. yeah, i thought so.....

Well buffalo we've now heard how much you give to charity how you treat your employees well. How yours is the American Dream, but when all is said done it is just a little anecdote from a humble christian boy telling us all how humble and perfect he is. Are you holding up yourself as an example of typical american small business or typical of america in general? I also run a small business and have for many years. I know how my competitors run their businesses. I see how many of them screw over their employees. I see them screw over their customers adding illegal charges to the bills they send out, some through ignorance some intentionally. I'm so sick and tired of listening to the personal responsibility drum beating on the right. Hey it's your own fault you got dupped by Enron, that your doctor was negligent, that General Motors told you your car was safe, that you enlisted in the military for a try one and got screwed by the cryptic small print. The buyer beware bullshit, if you are not an expert on every topic hey sorry you lack personal responsibilty. A civilized society protects its citizens from those who would take advantage. Whether everyone is as fucking perfect as you are is simply not relevant to the discussion. Those in business toot their little horns about how they provide the jobs, how they are special, while using a disproportionate share of the commons. Getting tax deductions to drive their fucking Hummers back and forth from work to home. You're breaking my heart. The deck is stacked and it is not in favor of the working man. There are few in business that offer to give up their own well being for others. They protect themselves by incorporating or adopting other forms of business that shield their personal assets. When they make mistakes, when others suffer through their actions they don't take PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY they take care of themselves and to their employees and creditors and customers they say hey that's business.

Norm - A little unfair to paste me as an ironic "humble christian boy" like i jumped into this blog with that info un-characterized as an enron loving, poor people hater, lining my pockets at the expense of the less fortunate. It's not like I was trying to respond to unfair characterizations or anything in offering that stuff up. I get the policy - that when attacked one does not get to defend oneself with the facts? Or when one does, you are then crowing? I get it. Nice double standard by the way. Poeple can say whatever they want without proof, be as insulting as possible, but to correct the record with confidence makes you disnegenuous. Sorry, I guess I should have just cursed at you all and offered nothing of substance. Then I would have been your typical poster here.

No, I don't hold myuself up as a typical small businessman. Nor do I hold myself up as a typical conservative thinker. Why, because there is no typical person on either side of the aisle. Which is why I don't deserve to be called uncompassionate by bubba, greedy by the mule, or arrogant by you. at the end of the day all we have is our personal conduct in whatever arena we operate in. the world of ideas is well and good, but if you want to change the world, then get off your sorry blogging behind and accomplish something - earn some money and give it away, achieve some power and use it wisely. aside from that i call you all dons, tipping at windmills. we can all tell michael jordan how to play a better game of basketball while we watch him on tv. you wanna get in the game and beat him to impress me. i'm in the game, and i'm conducting myself with integrity, in the vein that everyone seems to advocate is what should be done, and yet your little gang still wants to piss on my head. well that's why you'll continue to alienate everyone, continue to lose power, and never accomplish anything that you'd like to better society. big social programs and government won't get it done. the government is huge right now. how's that working for ya? divisiveness doesn't make anything better. civility and partnership do. so go ahead and sit in your little judgement perch while the rest of us run things. oh and by the way - pipe down a little, we're tryiung to run the world's economy here. bitch a little less loudly while you consume my tax dollars in public goods and services.

wb, you ever hear the story of the old lady who put the penny in the offering. What did Jesus say about her and those who offered out of their abundance. Do you really believe you are supporting something good for American's in privatizing social security? My foresight if you will allow. Tells me in ten years our homeless population will begin to age dramataly. In twenty the fed. gov. will need to build more bridges for them to sleep under, and probaly will. Privatizing would absolve our fed. gov. of all responsibility to their ageing. But that doesn't seem to concern you much. After all your barns are full.

Consume your tax dollars, sit on my judgment perch, get off my sorry blogging behind. I'm "in the game", I pay taxes, I have employees, I pay a livable wage. I'm simply not so arrogant as to believe that I should get all the credit for my participation, or that others that haven't had the same opportunities are slackers. Being in the game is not restricted to those that own the businesses, but also for those who work for them and the customers that purchase their products. Social programs and government won't get it done. No, but they certainly can help. It is that government that provides you with the infrastructure that makes your success possible. It is the commons you consume at rates that are higher than the average citizen that fairness requires that you pay more back into the system. The criticism of you has been unfair at times but understandable since you present yourself as how things are. Who the fuck is the we you're talking about, the owners, the ruling class. They are nothing without the workers and the consumers. You're right about one thing it is a partnership you simply fail to acknowledge all the members of that partnership. You don't want others to piss on your head, quit pissing on theirs, with it's the PEOPLE LIKE ME who make the "good life" possible for the rest of you. In your world the rest are slackers, who but for the grace of god and a white buffalo would be fucked. So pipe down and show a little humility. You are not solely responsible for your success, your role in it is a small one.

Great link Limuel Kolkava, many thanks.

And as for you Mister white buffalo;

Too bad your penis is not as large as your ego. Maybe you wouldn't be such a miserable, lonely little prick.

Yeah, I bet your employees all just adore you... to bad you can't hear what they have to say behind your "graduated with top honors at top university" azz!

If your so god damn sure your right, shut up.

You really do remind me of Bush Arrogant, sad, self-centerd, overrated, lonely, plenty of doe and still pissed off at the world. So much better than the rest of the "common little people." Trying to play the play "big shot."

Oh excuse me, you ARE a big shot! Wow, and knowing you own your own business to boot! Well hell, everyone know that atomatically qualiflies you for having a shred of human decency. And don't think for a moment that we don't know you've just been waiting like some spider for the opportunity to let us all know just how wonderful and self madeand important you are. Fuck, this could be Budubya!!

I think I've got a idea whats gettin' your gator. You don't have a clue who we are, what we do, or what we give. And it drives you nuts. Yep, this could be the man. Judging by your demands that we give you, of all people, all our personal information, it becomes quite clear what your all about. It must be very sad and lonely at the top of the world, and all that money too. Good lord with all that your busy giving away, I don't know how you manage to have the time to come here and share your wisdom. What a man!! That you demand to have information on total stranger on a blog were you know many of your postitions will not be accepted specks volumes!

I will leave you with a verse to never waste my good natured fun lovin' azz kickin' self again. Sorry others self-essteem gets on your nerves, you poor little victim of the gang.

Those who would take over the earth And shape it to their will Never, I notice, suceed. The earth, is like a vessel so sacred That at the mere approach of the profane It is marred And when they reach out their fingers it is gone For a time in the world some force themselves ahead And some are left behind, For a time in the world some make a great noise And some are held silent, For a time in the world some are puffed fat And some are kept hungry For a time in the world some push aboard And some are tipped out At some time in the world will a man who is sane Over-reach himself Over-spend himself Over-rate himself.

You have employees and pay a good wage - kudos to you. I respect that greatly. I never claimed I was solely responsible for my success. I claimed that I wasn't a heartless jerk, but everything is filtered through your "he's an ass because he's a Christian or because he has conservative leanings" filter. One does not imply the other. I am the most blessed man I know, and God is 100% solely responsible for my success and anything good I have.

WHITE BUFFALO. DON'T CONFUSE CONSERVATIVE TENDENCIES WITH THE ONLY VANTAGE POINT AVAILABLE TO CHRISTIANS. I AM A VERY LIBERAL CHRISTIAN. I REGULARY VISIT THIS BLOG,AND IT DOES THE GENERALLY SHARED APPROACH OF CHRISTIAN BASHING HERE DOES LIMIT MY POSTS. YOU ARE CORRECT, THEY ARE RATHER HARSH ON CHRISTIANS HERE, BUT THEN AGAIN, SO AM I BECAUSE I FIND THEM OFTEN INCONSISTENT. SO BACKED INTO A CORNER BY PEOPLE TELLING YOU WHO YOU ARE WITHOUT KNOWING ANYTHIING ABOUT YOU, YOU SHOW YOUR HEADSTRONG BUFFALO TENDENCIES, RIGHT? OR ARE YOU A BLOWHARD?

I certainly never accused you of being a heartless jerk on a personal level. Though I think some policies you support are heartless. You say "but everything is filtered through your "he's an ass because he's a Christian or because he has conservative leanings" filter" and yours is not filtered through he is a liberal that just doesn't understand what it is to run a business filter. Tis a fine line a Christian walks between arrogance and humility. There is a good bit of difference between God is 100% responsible for my success and the I do this and I do that and what have you done rhetoric we sometimes hear. I'm sure you do your very best and accept that you've done right by your employees and fellow man given your belief system. I admire that you are willing to engage in civil dialogue. We all cross the line from civility to rudeness from time to time. No one has the market cornered on civil behavior, but if in one's heart you believe your world-view is the correct and not subject to change, it is difficult to come accross as anything but arrogant. Tolerance and civility are predicated on being able to change one's mind based on new evidence. If you already have the "truth" it is unlikely you're looking for it. History is replete with examples of the negative consequences of that attitude. Acceptance of slavery is a good example from the past.

Oh, anon. I am often a blowhard, and hope to never be one again.....but am absolutely certain I will be. Most likely before the day is through. I agree with you that conservative political thoughts are not the only place Christians can settle. I just think it's a more efficient form of government, is all, not that it is ordained by God that government be small. I'm not Dubya - I don't think God loves the USA or its form of government. I am acutally a fairly liberal Christian theologically as I believe God loves everyone and wants everyone included, not excluded. There's no grade to sin. My sin is as tangible and offensive to him as anyone's who is gay, who murders, who does whatever. Only He judges, only He's clean enough to.

Norm - You say you didn't accuse me of being a hearltess jerk, but these were typed to me: "You got yours, so fk everyone else, Yeah I know you." and... "WB your Christian compassion is shining through again. You seem to have a case toward those less fortunate than you." So to personal attacks I submit my personal record, and instead of telling people to fck off in kind, I offer the same avenue of self definition. You are what you do. I become dismissive when it doesn't make a hoot of a difference what I say because I am prejudged. I don't have a "he's a liberal...business" filter. Most of the best businesses people I know are Democrats. I am from the only state that Mondale carried after all. There's is no government truth in my worldview, Norm. Jesus didn't care about governments. He was a power under guy - change the world through love. Governments are a power over affair - change the world through force. It's the cross vs the sword. I'm a cross kinda guy. So the way to set up businesses, society, forms of government, etc. are things on which I have ideas - not things that God has told me to think. It's that whole freewill thing - it's pretty sweet! I'm supposed to be a good guy no matter what form of government I prefer. So school me, my left leaning compatriots - just don't think you have the market cornered on compassion for your fellow man. It's an approach difference between us, not an intent difference. I don't assume you hate poor people because the government systems you want for this country seems to victimize them and create generation after generation of welfare families. I assume you have reasons for embracing that despite it's clear failures, and I would really like to hear them. Conversely, if I champion big business (which I don't), I'd expect you to hold my feet to the fire as to its clearly negative consequences on the environment, etc. All that can be done without anyone needing to sck anyone's dck.

That last anon was mine

So I charge you with arrogance and offer as evidence your advice to me to get off my blogging behind and accomplish something and be thankful and not complain so loudly while I spend YOUR TAX DOLLARS. So I stand by my charge of arrogance. Your turn, lets see your evidence of my lack of accomplishments. Fact is you know little of about my personal life or accomplishments. It was and is empty rhetoric with nothing to back it up. You don't like the groundless personal attacks and neither do I.

Lets move on to Lyndon Johnson and the big bad government's war on poverty an example of programs that actually worked in reducing the rate of poverty in this country. All the Republican rhetoric to the contrary we've basically made no progress since then, but that is as it should be according to Republican dogma. The poor are that way because they are lazy and lack self-discipline and that wonderful catch all self-responsibility. Put yourself in a poor family lower your IQ by twenty points give you a drunk for a father and a whore for a mother and let me guess where you would be today. And please don't give me one of those anecdotel tales of the young man who against all odds rose to great heights. You know and I know that those stories are the exception not the rule. And satisfy my curiosity and tell me how old you are. Here is a link to some information on the Johnson Legacy. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1589660

I please guilty to responding childishly and without factual basis to your foul mothed friends accusations. My apologies.

I'm 36, and I'm not a Republican, so their dogma doesn't really interest me.

Here are the stats: http://www.census.gov/hhes/poverty/histpov/hstpov13.html

Poverty rate hasn't changed significantly in this country since the launch of the great society programs. During this period, however, social security as a percentage of GDP has increased from 2.7% to 4.3%, Medicare went from ostenisbly 0% since it was launched in 1967 to 2.5% of GDP, Medicaid has gone from 0 to 1.5% of GDP.
http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=1821&sequence=0

All this government spending and a pverty rate that doesn't change. Giving a man in a snow storm a blanket is not the same as inviting him inside. Mitigating the impact of poverty is what these programs do. Solving poverty is what they need to do.

Begging your pardon Herr Jesus. But I just rolled up and counted the words you might consider foul. I have one. You have a shit load if you count ** and innuendoes that might translate into asshole. And I'm really broken up by your snub. If me and the mule ain't good enough for you cross kinda guys. Well I think I'll let the Missiouri Mule explain it to you. Norm I sure was glad to find out I am your friend.

I don't have any problem with you responding to childish taunts with childish taunts of your own but please direct them at the guilty parties, and though I would prefer a more elevated level of discussion it is a difficult proposition to enforce. Take that as a reprimand to all of the foul mouth vipers that frequent this blog. Don't miss understand I have no problem with a foul mouth when said mouth offers some reasons for their opinions and the foul words are simply offered as emphasis for a point being made. But nasty personal attacks sans arguments and evidence are not welcome. Try to deal with the issues folks not the personalities. Now back to you buffalo. You say you don't share the Republican dogma but it seems to me you are right in tune with their emphasis on self-reliance and self-discipline, a tough love approach both to ones own children and society. That virtues are developed through rewards and punishment and that basically people usually get what they deserve. That the difficulties in life serve as a test to sort the deserving from the undeserving. Not true? Rates of 18% in the early 60's to single digits not an impovement? Then stagnation from the mid seventies on, and If I'm not mistaken different criteria used to measure from the Bush administration. Mitigating the impact of poverty is better than the tough love and if you fail fuck you approach favored by the Right. So you're not a Republican would you care to label yourself.

I'm walking into a pretty rowdy pillow fight here, but I'll put in a few comments. They are obvious to some (and redundant of previous comments) but need to be said:

1) Social Security is only "headed for disaster" if the government does not pay back the IOUs is has in the social security trust fund. Otherwise it is solvent for many years to come, until most of the baby boomers die. Bush promised that this fund would not be touched, and that a trillion bucks would be set aside for contingencies. Now he's long ago raidied the fund and even considers it part of the normal government budget for accounting purposes. If it weren't for the Soc Sec surplus the deficit number would (and should if accounting were frank) be much bigger. Bush compromised the program severely and now we're letting him "fix it"?

2) In all the talk of reform, few people ask is social security really going to be a security? Is there going to be a guaranteed check for everyone? That is the real question. If it doesn't, it's not social security anymore, it's a wall street scheme to get government funds. Social security has all but eliminated poverty among the elderly in America, at a fraction of the administrative costs of any pension plan out there. Oh but "the rate of return is low". Compared to what? A mutual fund that guarantees you nothing? Sure. But for the poor, the rate of return is very good, even compared to other pension plans. But it precisely the poor who have the most trouble saving for retirement. Their employers get a free break--many of them don't provide a pension and can pocket the money or invest it. The government is picking up the tab as much for these employers as it is for the poor. The middle class and rich (who get their checks too) are much more likely to be able to save for retirement even after payroll taxes and everything else. Their retirement isn't a big problem.

3) Reforms are needed, even though the problem wouldn't be so bad if it weren't for Bush. You can't get out of the problem through growth, since benefits are tied to current wages. And you can't keep going like we have been--that means continuing to increase payroll taxes. These taxes are regressive, but reducing them is a problem also since people perceive these taxes as contributions to a pension plan. Benefits tied to contributions. There need to be some reforms, perhaps involving the retirement age, reduction in benefits possibly, etc. But these reforms should NOT be a way to bail out the government from raiding the trust fund. That will only give the GOP a greater incentive to raid the fund even more, in order to turn popular opinion against the program and eventually kill it. Reforms can only be part of a plan which returns the government to fiscal responsibilty and stops the general budget from borrowing social security funds. Any other reform plan could be used to destroy the program.

Norman Cousins once said life is an adventure in forgiveness.

So towards that end I'm sorry for telling you to suck Ann Couulters dick, white buffalo, it was wrong and rude, and SO like me. I'm sorry, I hope you can forgive me. My words were not appropriate.

I also apologize to you Norm.

Name-calling, intentional put-downs and hateful rejection no longer provide the perverse pleasure of years gone by.

I'm truly sorry and rest assured I have kicked my own opinioned azz sufficiently for the two of you. I will make all efforts to keep the filtly langange to a minimun.

By the way, dende blogger, I just love it when cooler, calmer heads prevail! Thanks

Ok, I'm going to the barn for a well deserved time out. lol

Thanks MM! My apologies for acting like a 13 year old to you and Bubba.

Apology accepted. We both were probably taught the Golden Rule when we were young, but practiced it with mixed success. None are perfect, and I'm sure we will continue to tread on one another's toes and hearts with regularity, not because we're mean, but because we can be insensitive at times.

Now back to my time out.

Michael Kinsley on SS privatization:

My contention: Social Security privatization is not just unlikely to succeed, for various reasons that are subject to discussion. It is mathematically certain to fail. Discussion is pointless.

The usual case against privatization is that (1) millions of inexperienced investors may end up worse off, and (2) stocks don't necessarily do better than bonds over the long-run, as proponents assume.But privatization won't work for a better reason: it can't possibly work, even in theory. The logic is not very complicated.

[...]

Q.E.D.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week200412_12.php#004237

A word before parting. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, its a fucking duck. Though I know I'm a simple man considered incapable of intelligent debate by many who consider themselves my betters. One thing I know, time for debate is past. Why should I waste my efforts with beastly men who condone tourture, murder and invasion of sovreign countries. Screw them all. No more Mr. nice guy. They beleive they have cornered the market on integrity, rightousness, and wisdom. While the blood of the innocents contuines to flow. These self appointed rightous spokesmen of bushes fourth reich, belittle our anger by attacking our choice of words. As if their holy ears were offended. I find insuferable offence in their very existence. War Pigs, Hate Mongers, Wolves in sheeps clothing everyone. Brood of vipers, Painted tombs who on the outside appear beautiful to men. But on the inside are full of dead mens bones and everything unclean. Kick them in the nuts! There is nothing intelligent, wise, or holy, in anything they stand for.

Bubba don't you dare leave or I'll slit my wrist, I swear. Your right on my brother and it's time for some civil dis-obedience!

"Salus populi suprema lex esto" The welfare of the people shall be the surpreme law.

MM and Bubba - Do you have guns for this civil disobedience? It's interesting, because your arguments for civil disobedience mirror very closely part of the NRA's platform for keeping guns in citizens hands - namely to protect the rights of citizens against a potentially (or in this case actually) tyrannical government. Wouldn't that be the end all commentary on how polarizing Bush is - he gets the left to endorse gun ownership for civil disobedience purposes. I've already got mine.

WB you are such an ass. I'm sorry I left out masters of deception.You show about as much respect for your lessers as rumsfeld does. Would you like an itemized list of my weaponry? Or will you be satisfied with only a list of my wmds? I have only one weapon in this war and its my conviction to resist tyranny. No matter what form it takes. I'm not afraid.

lessers? ass? damn Bubba thats my M-O? Cut a Mule some slack, jack!